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So, Facebook renames itself meta in reference to the metaverse, makes that their whole identity,

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releases a couple VR headsets, and then Apple comes along with their own, much better headset,

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and doesn't say the word metaverse once in their presentation. And do I have that right?

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That is correct. How do you, how do you feel if you're Mark Zuckerberg at this point?

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Does he feel? If he feels anything, it's probably some feeling that kind of sounds like this.

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I was thinking more of leg up, leg up.

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Well shucks. Oh no. Yeah, apparently he gave a, they just had an all hands meeting at Facebook, where he

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said something like, okay guys, let's sell down here, Apple did the, you know, they released

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their own headset, but they have no quote unquote, magic solutions, magical solutions.

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Yeah, he specifically mentioned that they didn't, that they were following what was

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at the same laws of physics as they were, like they didn't have any magical solutions

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to the laws of physics that our teams haven't already explored and thought of.

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And he needed to say that because sometimes it really does seem like Apple is bending

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the laws of space and time to talk through their asses.

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Well, it seems more like they're, they're bending the laws of their customers' wallets.

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Bam. Got them. Guys, this is TalkLinked in case you were wondering.

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Normally we release a TechLinked episode where it's just like a roundup of the daily

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news, but we're busy. Something's happening at the company today, so we're going to talk about Apple's announcement

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of the Vision Pro headset in a bit more detail, especially in the context of these comments

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that Mark Zuckerberg just made.

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It's got to be crazy. I mean, so we have both tried VR to a certain extent.

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You've tried it way more than I have. I've kind of like followed along with the developments in VR, so I'm somewhat familiar.

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You've tried a PSVR. Yes.

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So you had all that experience here, the AR King on ShortCircuit.

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Meanwhile, I ... Oh, that's true. Yeah.

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I've tried those AR glasses. That's right. Meanwhile, what I did was I bought a PSVR for full price at the end of the life of the

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PlayStation 4. So both of us having these experiences is interesting because in the context of Apple releasing a

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product in this category, sort of, I mean, they call it a different category, spatial

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computing. But our experience here represents very much a niche, like most people, I would say, have

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not tried either AR or VR, augmented reality or virtual reality, terms that may become

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obsolete if Apple has their way. But now Apple is ...

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Is it spatial computing? What's that? Yeah.

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Well, you know, I can't wait until next year when they revolutionize the temporal computing,

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then we can finally compute all of the spacetime continuum together at once.

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Spatial computing, temporal computing. And at that point, I mean, we don't even need AI in case we will have the ability to control

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wormholes. Absolutely. Awesome.

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If anyone, Apple, will do it. Back to this launch, Apple is ... You know, they've done this with a few categories now

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where there is an existing product category. There is innovation being done in an industry.

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Cell phones are a thing. Yeah. Smartwatches, I think they were starting to become a thing.

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Pebble, I think, was out and it was like ... It's still everyone's favorite.

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Oh, Pebble came ... Yeah, for sure. Yeah.

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Yeah. So there were definitely smartwatches, but this is what Apple does, even when I think

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back, and I've been covering this stuff since 2013.

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So even when I think back, I have to think for a second before I remember that, oh, Apple

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actually wasn't the company that did define that category.

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I mean, with the iPhone, with the Apple Watch, with the iPad, but that's the thing.

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They didn't start the category. I think that's ... But they might have defined it.

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Yeah. I think part of it is they have this very smart linguistic trick that they do where they

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don't call the thing the thing. Yes.

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They give it a name, and then they wait for everybody else to call it that thing.

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So they're doing it right now. They have the Vision Pro.

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Never once did they mention VR, AR, none of that.

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They didn't say this is a VR headset. This is an AR headset. I don't even know if they said mixed reality.

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No. I don't think they did. No, nothing like that.

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But then everybody already starts because they see that product.

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They know the category. It's like, oh, that's a VR headset. Oh, that's an AR headset.

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And so then all of a sudden, you know that their named product, it not only is that,

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but it's the one you think of because you're the one that has to put that together.

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They never say it. Yeah. And I think that covering this, it has seemed awkward even to use those other terms.

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So like every time there's a headset or glasses or whatever that involves some sort of thing,

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like a screen near your face, mounted on your face, and it's displaying things, it's like,

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do I call this VR? Do I call it AR? Do I call it XR?

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Which I guess is a stand in for mixed reality.

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Do I call it? Yeah. I mean, apparently XR, according to the geniuses of Wikipedia, I think believe it means extended

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reality. Oh, yeah, right. Right.

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There's extended reality. There's the metaverse, which meta- Was a dystopian idea from a novel?

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Yeah. Yeah. We don't learn.

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But even I, who have been covering these things, struggle to which adjective do I use?

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Which category, definer thing do I use? And I have to give it to Apple in the sense that calling it spatial computing, that can

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catch on, I think. I would much rather refer to like, you know, the Unreal thing, the Unreal glasses that I've

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covered on ShortCircuit as a spatial computing product rather than like, they're not VR glasses.

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It's not a VR headset. They're sort of like AR, but some of them don't actually track with your head.

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I mean, you can track your head, but that's only in a, it's a whole thing.

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There's always caveats, right? So I think calling the whole category spatial computing, this is generally the type of thing

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where you have a display near your face and you are moving around and maybe interacting

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with it with either controllers or your hands or whatever.

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I have to give it to Apple. I want to call it that. I would rather call it something like virtual computing.

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Like that makes sense to me. Whatever you call it, the Vision Pro does it.

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Exactly. Kind of what Apple wants us to think.

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They're like, okay, this is the category defining product. So let's take a bit of a look at the actual product itself.

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In case you missed out on the, holy crap, it was such a long keynote.

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It was like two hours and 40 minutes or something. Yeah, it was crazy.

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It was crazy writing TechLink that day after watching it. Oh my gosh.

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Like, guys, window into the process of writing TechLinked, it's already kind of hectic enough

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to try and like make a video in one day about the like trending topics that are happening

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right then. You're trying to get all the accurate information as it's happening.

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And then instead of writing for two hours, you watch something for two hours so that

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you can then write about it for another two hours.

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It's got to be here. Like how long is it? Okay.

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It was only two hours. Yeah. It seemed way longer.

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Ugh. Well, that's just because Craig Federighi kept on jumping out and jumping back in and it

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was confusing. Hey, what the heck? This is supposed to be, last time I went to this, this was a 3D model.

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It was kind of cool. Now they got rid of it.

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Or maybe, whatever. That's too bad.

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I wanted to show you guys like the actual 3D structure in case you hadn't seen much of

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it. But as you can see here, the thing that was immediately impressive to me during the keynote

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was how slim it is.

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That's kind of been the whole struggle over the VR generations.

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I mean, the first like, you know, the Oculus, if any of you guys were around for like the

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DK1, that was a brick.

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It was just like you're sticking a brick on your face. It was like a virtual boy, but like only slightly smaller.

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Yeah, honestly. And it was like very square. It was, there was like crazy screen door effects, really small FOV.

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And still though, it was enchanting because I remember sitting at my desk at NCIX and

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like having that first roller coaster experience, but like where you're, you know, I'm stationary

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sitting at my desk and I'm looking around. It was still kind of mind blowing.

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So to arrive at this time in 2023 and see that we have been able to like get this down

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to this slim is pretty crazy. Although I will say I've seen some other people's impressions of it and listened to them.

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And apparently the headset is quite heavy.

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That makes sense. Which is probably not helped by the fact that it doesn't have an overhead strap.

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I wonder if they have like, if they're going to have an accessory like that.

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They only have this rear headband that goes around the back of your head.

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And then the thingy that like goes onto your face. Yeah.

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I mean, I wasn't thinking that when they did the, the, the demo because it looks slim.

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It looks like goggles, right? And you don't need a top strap for goggles.

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But this is, they said it's made of metal and glass.

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So like, yeah, it's, it's, it's like, do you want to wear ski goggles made?

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Like it's, it's their ski goggles, but with a computer inside, including the M2 chip.

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So it's like a full computer. And the R1 processor. And the new R1 processor, which is only to handle all the input from all of these sensors

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that it has. Does this page have stuff about sensors here for the cameras and sensors?

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Give me something good. It has. Ooh, here we go.

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Yeah. Got to say, I love, I love their sights.

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I, you know what? Like, they know how to design things.

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Here's, here's the thing, because if you cared about VR, like nerds, like I'm a nerd.

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I'm not like a, you know, uh, Linus level nerd, but I'm a nerd and I like VR.

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I think it's cool. I've definitely experimented with it on my own time outside of what we've had to do

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for work and like, I'm into it.

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And so I think that seeing this presentation, it's $3,500.

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Obviously, I'm not going to buy it. That is ridiculous.

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It's going to be for the very wealthy early adopters. Is it though?

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It is. But, okay, wait, devil's advocate, go from Apple's perspective.

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Okay. It's worth it. Why?

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Here's the thing. So I thought the MediQuest Pro was the stupidest thing I've ever heard of in my life.

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Whoa. When they announced it, I mean, obviously they did that massive price cut and I'm pretty

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sure they confirmed that they're not doing an update. They're not doing a sequel to that.

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They're not? To the MediQuest Pro. No, no, no, no.

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Really? I'm pretty sure. Like someone up at Metta said like, yeah, they're not, because it did not do well at

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all. No, it did not.

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But it also came out like as VR was dying, like when did it, when did it come out?

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It came out November 2022, just as AI was like really taking off.

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That? Dali 2 had dominated the news cycle and then ChatGPT came out a month later.

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Well, here's, here's, I mean, but that honestly, I don't even think that matters because if

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the product was good, it could have revived VR or kept it alive.

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It could have, what it should have done and what Apple is obviously trying to do here

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is trying to bridge the gap between, because the MediQuest Pro, they specifically were

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targeting Enterprise. Like they were like, oh, this is all about business.

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You can use this in business to have meetings from remotely where you can have avatars even

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though like people are already doing things in person and the pandemic's kind of ending.

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But still. So that was their focus.

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Now what Apple's done and you see that in the presentation is yeah, they talk about

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what you can do with it at work. But the first thing they show you is a woman in the WWC keynote is a woman sitting on her

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couch just using it casually.

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That's the first thing you see. And then they spend, and I timed this, about five minutes talking about how it can work

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for you at work and then about five minutes equally talking about what it can do for you

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at home. Yeah. I was actually surprised how little time they spent talking about the applications

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for work, especially because it's a pro product.

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A couple of people have pointed out at this point that it's $3,500, but they were also

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explicitly launching it as a pro, it's a vision pro, not just Apple vision.

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And with everything else, we got the non-pro product before we got the pro, the iPhone,

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then the iPhone pro, watch, and then the watch Ultra, and then the iPad, and then the iPad

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pro, and I mean MacBook. We're waiting for the vision pro Max.

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Yeah, vision pro Max, vision pro Max Ultra.

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It's just a helmet. It's a whole head transplant.

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Dude, now when I'm drinking water, come on. Yeah, I was surprised.

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Yeah, but like that's, here's sort of the genius of Apple at work, at least in marketing

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and the way they design their products is that they specifically show that this device,

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so Meta is a company that you know for social media, right?

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They have Facebook, they have Instagram, they have Oculus, that's like the one hardware

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thing that they do. You don't really think about the brain loss. Apple has, first of all, the luxury of having an ecosystem, but the other thing is that

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everybody's familiar with that ecosystem, even the people that don't use it.

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So when they show off the vision pro, they don't have to talk that much about what it

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can do because basically what they're saying is, oh, it's a Mac you can put on your face,

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but then also on top of being a Mac you can put on your face, it can interface with your

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Mac and your iPad and your iPhone wirelessly.

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It's huge and like following this story as it developed for so long, did you have a sense

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of watching, when we were watching the keynote, did you have a sense of like, oh my gosh,

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this is happening, this is real? Yeah. It was like an out of body experience for me.

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I don't know if I go that far. Not because I was so, so excited, but I was just kind of like, this is the reality I live

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in is that Apple just is launching a VR headset.

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What? It's messed up. Well, I know.

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I mean, me and Mark Gurman have a, we go way back.

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We have a very one-sided relationship, but I follow all of everything he writes because

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I have to. And so everything that he said, like everything, most of the things that were in the keynote,

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I already kind of knew from Mark Gurman's slow leaks.

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He was DMing you. So you were DMing him. No, it's just his newsletters, man.

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He's good. He protects his sources and he informs the public. And like, so if you read what he says about Apple, like he, like it's there.

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So like all of the things he said about like the, creating the persona, having said that,

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I'm pretty sure he predicted that it would produce, I thought it was going to produce

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like a full body sort of model.

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Oh, they never really talked about that. Of the persona? One of the things he said originally was that two people with the Apple's headset, they

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would be able to basically, it would create a virtual version of each other.

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So it was like when you two are talking, you're in the same room, but it was only for two

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because it would take too much processing power. They didn't talk about that at all in the keynote.

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So I don't know if that's actually true, but we saw them show a normal persona that

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just fits in a nice little square that you would use for FaceTime.

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Right, right. But like most of the things that were said at the keynote, like I expected, there were

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things I didn't expect though, like the whole environment thing and the adjustable immersion.

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Right. For anyone who doesn't know, environments, it's just the VR function.

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That's just what it is. Is it shuts off the rest of the world so you don't see outside, there's no pass through

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and you see something else. This is just crazy as well. The shadows?

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Yeah. It doesn't seem that hard and I know that probably other companies could do this with

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their AR products, but I think seeing the Apple polish and I know this is just a render,

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but like it's not usually like Apple to show a demo like this and then to have you experience

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it and have it be like, oh, that was just marketing.

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And to that point, most of the people who tried it out actually said, this looks good.

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Yeah. It's not evolution. It's responsive.

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Yeah. I mean, Mark has said. There were some drawbacks.

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Yeah. I think there was like, at least when I was reading the Verges coverage of what they did,

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there were things that they weren't able to try. I don't think they were able to try taking 3D video.

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What I'm super disappointed with still is the fact that you can't use it with glasses.

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I mean, like, you know, how many nerds are there out there that are into VR that wear

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glasses? Probably lots. There's also a lot of nerds that make a lot of money and can probably afford the Zeiss

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lenses. Yeah. Sorry.

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I mean, like, so my rage towards this is probably misplaced to the fact that you have to buy

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Zeiss prescription lenses that are compatible, like from Apple that you can screw on to the

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actual lenses. The N-real or not the N-real, the Rokid, the recent AR glasses that I did on ShortCircuit,

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the Rokid had built in, I forget what it's called, but it's the thing.

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Myopic adjustment. Something like that.

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I forget, there's a word, I forget the word, but it's basically, I could use it without

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my glasses. And I could, there was a dial where I could dial it in and then I could see it clearly.

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And that was great. And I'm like, why can't Apple just throw in something like that, you know?

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It's kind of silly. Like, they even have the crown on there.

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They threw on the digital crown from the Apple Watch, but the only thing that they've

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shown that being for in the demos is to transition from the kind of AR mode where you can see

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the outside world to the environment, quote-unquote, VR mode.

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And I'm like, is that really what that's for? Yeah.

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Could you brought that up? Because that's incremental.

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So it's not like all or nothing. Yeah. Yeah.

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But I'm like, what's the point of that? Why do you want an incremental environment? According to...

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I'm partially in space. According to the Apple, according to the Verge, it's that what Apple imagines is that in the

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workplace, you have most of your screen real estate being the environment and then you

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have your peripheral open so you can still see and interact with your coworkers.

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Here's the other... I just thought of this, this might be BS, but here's the other reason you might need

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this is that... So they showed that kind of like you're sitting and then a person walks in and all of a sudden

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you see them and they're looking at you like they just appear in the environment.

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Now that's probably fine in say a home environment when you're doing something normal, ideally

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not watching like a horror movie, but like in the office, in the office when you're like

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in a flow state, you're probably sitting at a desk, people can't come and walk in front

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of you. They're going to probably want to walk to the side of you.

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I wouldn't really want people, even if I was wearing this headset to be tapping me on

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the shoulder. I'm kind of one of those people. I don't like that, especially not when I'm in somewhere and then all of a sudden I feel

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touched and I'm seeing desert sands and all of a sudden I feel someone touch me.

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That's a little... I mean, I think that like if you're using it at work, you probably are aware of the fact

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that people are probably going to have to talk to you at some point.

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Have you seen these environments though? They take you away. There might be Star Wars ones too, because of Disney, so I'm going to be on Tatooine.

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And that's a whole other thing. But that's why I can understand why you might want to leave that open, so that when people

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come to the side of your desk and they're like, hey, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah,

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and they start talking, you can still hear them. You know what I don't understand?

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This. I just don't know about this, because almost every demo image they have of this is pretty

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much straight on. So like if this person looks around, if you do one of these, okay, your eyes are doing

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a whole circle, like it's like putting tubes on your eyes and then you're doing this and

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look what the tubes are doing. It's going to look goofy.

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So it's like, what was the kind of the point of this? It's like you can have social interactions.

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I'm not sure I understood the tube analogy here. Look at this.

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Look at this. You're saying you have like snail eyes? Look at this.

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Look at this. Yeah. Imagine my eyes on the end of this tube and now I'm like, yes, yes, that no, like my eyes

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are doing loop-de-loops. They're all over the place. Maybe it's got some sort of adjustment for that.

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Maybe I've not explained this properly. No, no, no, I get it now. I get it now because it's like different from you.

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It's like away from your face, so like they're going to move at a larger angle than the rest

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of your face is. Yeah. It's hard for me to explain.

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The point is, it's like this is cool, but it's also kind of pointless because any social

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interaction you have with someone that is like significant enough, that is significantly

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long enough to justify showing your eyes on the front, is also going to be one in which

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you take the headset off because screw that.

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No, those are the people that want me to take my headset off.

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I spent $3,500 on that headset. I am not taking it off.

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I am being immersed. This is my reality now.

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I think that this is, I'm not saying it's the perfect solution, but I can see why they

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did it. They needed something that would sort of bridge that gap and I kind of, you know, I was looking

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at this, how they have this, they really want to focus.

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They have this emphasis on the transition between being isolated and then having outside

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awareness, but also being able to interact with the outside world while still maintaining

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the usage of the device. And that's really the biggest obstacle to VR when you think about it, like the joke

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is like you see someone in a full VR setup and they have like a bodysuit on that tracks

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every movement and then all of a sudden like their mom calls them for dinner and they got

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to take all of it off to the upstairs. Like I, you're not going to, you're going to take this off too.

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Sounds like what's it, I don't know if it's comfortable enough. I don't know if I would.

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I mean, they did, they studied dinner, wearing a VR headset, Riley.

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They studied thousands of heads.

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It serves the function of, of letting people know when they can see, letting, yeah, letting

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an outside person know when the person in VR can see them. Yeah. When we're ready, when I'm ready to give a about you, you'll know because you'll see

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my fake eyes. But can that also be achieved by speaking to the person and having the person respond

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and say one second or it's also a phone.

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It's a fair, but I could see a scenario where this could fulfill, fulfill a function for

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someone in VR to like be sassy to someone outside because you walk up to them, you're

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like, Hey, can I talk to you? And then you see their eyes appear on the headset.

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They don't say anything. They just look. It's like, you can see me, right? They don't say anything.

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It's like, wow, I'm glad Apple put this feature in. So this person could be passive aggressive to me.

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I want to talk about meta and I want to talk about what is going to happen to VR because,

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you know, spatial computing, we've been around, sorry, spatial computing.

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We've been around to see kind of the rises and falls of these tech of this tech.

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VR has been a niche thing. The quest one came out in 2019 and the pandemic hit.

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People were like, Hey, actually, this is cool. Yeah, we're staying at home.

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And now, like that, that is part of what drove an increased interest in VR to such

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an extent that meta released the quest to October 13th, 2020, right after I'm going

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to show you their stock, right after where's 2020.

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So like, here's where they release the quest to before that point.

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You know, it's kind of a steady. It looks like a tech giant stock. It's just kind of like slowly going up.

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They release that. I don't know what the dip is about, but then this is like, ooh, VR hype, metaverse hype.

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Everyone's talking about metaverse, metaverse, metaverse all day, every day.

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And then that confidence as everyone else comes in and starts talking about meta about

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meta metaverse stuff, you remember, or you weren't here for that part.

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But I existed in the world. And so in that way, I remember.

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Okay. I'm not sure how that works. So existing in a world.

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Yeah, because I'm so into the metaverse and so and all these people were too.

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It's a big spike. And then so we get into 2022.

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Now there's a bunch of stuff happening with meta, you know, they made some gaffes.

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I don't want to go over their entire stock history, but the main thing I want to

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point out here is that Dolly too comes out and that is sort of the starting point

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for the AI hype. Yeah. Over the course of 2022, AI just steals the show from VR for metaverse stuff at all.

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And it's all been about AI stuff. I think it's also important to note that this was like the end of like pandemic era

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demand. That's true. That's that's a factor as well.

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MetaQuest Pro comes out in November 2022.

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Meta has had an identity crisis. They went from Facebook because that's the whole reason they've renamed, right?

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It's because Facebook had all of this data leaking scandal, election fraud stuff,

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like, you know, Cambridge Analytica and all that stuff. Like they tried to use it.

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They tried to escape from all that and try to make a new identity for themselves.

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Okay. Like, yeah, we own Facebook, but really we're going to be all about the metaverse.

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We're going to be VR AR. Let's go. And then hype just died off and they're like, Oh, well, it's a good thing.

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We got our AI researchers going in the background. Let's focus on that.

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We're going to dump stuff into AI. And so that looked like it was going to be a thing.

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And then open AI comes out and they're just like chat, GBT, what's up?

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And it's like, Oh, right. Meta is doing important research still and like Lama, it was their model that

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will, you know, is now kind of out in the public. It got leaked and so that's, they are a basis for.

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Revolutionizing open source AI right now.

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LLM, as we know it. For sure. But, you know, they're not getting any money from that.

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They are not. Um, so now they're like, okay, wait.

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So we can't, you know, we got leapfrogged, uh, in, uh, in AI.

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So maybe we can go back to doing VR stuff and then they released the Quest Pro.

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It flops. Apple comes out a few months later and releases this thing.

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And now they're just like, like, what did we do? Are we, what do we do as a company?

331
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Go back to social media. Everyone hates you.

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Are they dead? They might be dead. I mean, Instagram still gets.

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I mean, yes, sorry, they're not dead, they're far from dead.

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It's true. I really feel like part of it too. I don't think the only reason they renamed was, was to escape the scandal.

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I think part of it was that Zuckerberg realized the truth.

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And that is that Facebook is a dying platform. They have this company, Oculus, that became the name of VR.

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And it's still maintained that for a very long time, still now.

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And I think VR on PC, I think Oculus. Yeah.

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So his gamble wasn't stupid.

340
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It was, it was, it was educated, but he didn't do it right.

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And, and his focus was not maybe in the right place. So he tried to remake them after they already owned a company

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that was the name of VR, VR, right, which is weird.

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I would have, I would have made it like there's, I would have made them Oculus instead.

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I would have made the overarching name like Oculus or some sort of version of Oculus.

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I don't think people would, I don't know if people would accept that.

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I mean, I don't know whether accepting the name is even a part of that equation.

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But anyway, now going into the future, he made this wrong gamble.

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He's gotten leapfrogged over AI, though he has arguably access to one of the largest data sets ever.

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I mean, then that's why that's probably a big part of why we were able to get into AI.

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So like that probably looks great for, I mean, hell, we looked at Cicero.

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Yeah. And that was incredibly impressive. Like they, they probably are going to do great for AI in terms of VR.

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I think, I think in terms of people who just want a game and who want to have that experience,

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because it is the least the first time you do it. They might game on a mind blow.

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The first time you put on a VR headset, it is a mind blowing experience.

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I remember getting the PSVR, putting it on and playing Star Wars squadrons.

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And, and it was like, it was like I was living a childhood dream of piloting an X-Wing.

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And I legitimately cried. Tears came out of my eyes. Wow.

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I was there were tears of joy. It was, it was, it was like a life changing experience for a moment.

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I 100% empathize with that. I had like a very similar experience.

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But yeah, it was very much like a, this is, this is happening.

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I'm in an X-Wing. Yeah, I'm a pilot. I'm a rebel pilot.

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And then I played, and then I played a VR game called Blood and Truth, which is like a super cool cinematic like spy slash like gangster game.

363
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And I was like, this is how all games should be always and forever

364
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until the end of time. It's really funny, like as someone who has used VR extensively,

365
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it's, it is funny how there wasn't more of a reaction of like, oh my gosh,

366
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this is what gaming needs to be. Yeah. But I think that, you know, people are in different life situations.

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I have almost no time to do this anymore as a father or doing renovations

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stuff in my apartment. I'm so busy, but like for people with more time, you know, you, you,

369
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you set up your space, you like get used to the whole thing.

370
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It's not, you know, it's not a plug and play experience like a console

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where you just hook it up to your TV and you sit down, you play. It's like, you know, a little bit more involved.

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So I understand why it didn't catch on, but like as a gamer with the time to do

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it, it's like, why? So. But here's what you just said.

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Here's kind of the genius and the potential projection of the future

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of, of spatial computing based on the vision pros, everything you just said.

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So like you're running around, you don't have that much time to game.

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Let's say you bought a vision pro for some reason, you put it on, you can

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play a hundred games on Apple Arcade on day one.

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Apple Arcade with game controller support and help maybe, maybe there will

380
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be game porting toolkit support later, which would be insane and super cool.

381
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Can you imagine that? But well, I don't know if the M two in the maybe not headset can like run

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Windows games to the fidelity. I mean, like people are running on an M two max one max and it was chugging a

383
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little bit chugging a little bit, but I met like, but like, was an M one max.

384
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Yeah. The cyberpunk was running on an M one and maybe, but so it's possible.

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The other, the other thing is like, so, you know, you have a little bit of time

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to game or play or whatever you put on, you put on your vision pro, you're doing

387
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it and all of a sudden your, your wife calls you and like, Oh, when I need

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your help doing this thing, you don't have to take off the headset necessarily.

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If Apple is able to make people give people the feeling that they've

390
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forgotten they're wearing glasses, if they can get to the point where people

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were, where someone goes, honey, no, I mean, like literally, like, you know,

392
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how sometimes you forget you're wearing glasses. Like if you ever had the experience where you're like, crap, where'd I

393
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leave my glasses and they're on your face? I get what you're saying, but that's not going to, if they can get, if they

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can create, this is, this is what you're saying, but like in four years,

395
00:33:00,900 --> 00:33:07,060
yeah, that's what I'm glasses version. Well, that, but also if they can start to get us toward that point, then it

396
00:33:07,060 --> 00:33:10,220
becomes more of a, a consumer product.

397
00:33:10,300 --> 00:33:17,140
That's something that anybody can use. That's true. I, so I'll answer the question I asked earlier about, like, you know, META is

398
00:33:17,140 --> 00:33:21,180
VR over and stuff. As you said, I believe META is going to be fine.

399
00:33:21,180 --> 00:33:27,140
You know, they've, I don't, I don't see META going out of business anytime

400
00:33:27,140 --> 00:33:31,060
soon. They obviously, they still have Facebook, which, you know, as cringe as it is

401
00:33:31,060 --> 00:33:34,500
among younger people now, it's still probably profitable.

402
00:33:34,500 --> 00:33:37,740
Moms spend money. I don't know. Marketplace is thriving.

403
00:33:37,860 --> 00:33:43,380
Moms spend money. Facebook marketplace is used, it's like the primary way I see people buying and

404
00:33:43,380 --> 00:33:46,580
selling stuff, Instagram, WhatsApp, they have all these things.

405
00:33:46,940 --> 00:33:53,180
And so META is probably going to be fine. VR slash spatial computing, whatever.

406
00:33:53,460 --> 00:33:58,460
I think that if it survives, it will, and sorry, it will survive.

407
00:33:58,500 --> 00:34:02,460
It will, even if, even in a world in which Apple never released the Vision Pro,

408
00:34:02,940 --> 00:34:06,380
VR endures, that kind of keeps chugging in the background.

409
00:34:06,380 --> 00:34:09,860
It will remain a niche thing, but in a world in which Vision Pro has launched

410
00:34:09,860 --> 00:34:14,500
and which Apple continues to iterate on these products and maybe releases a more

411
00:34:14,500 --> 00:34:18,620
affordable version later, Apple is going to have an impact on this industry.

412
00:34:19,900 --> 00:34:23,940
To a similar level that they've had on like the smartwatch industry and the

413
00:34:23,940 --> 00:34:31,940
tablet industry and the laptop industry. Like there's a reason every high end Windows laptop looks kind of like a MacBook.

414
00:34:32,220 --> 00:34:37,540
There's a reason every tablet is compared to an iPad. There's a reason every smartwatch is compared to an Apple watch.

415
00:34:38,260 --> 00:34:43,820
Apple has released what I view as the category defining product in this industry.

416
00:34:44,740 --> 00:34:49,780
Even though it's $3,500, that's going to be bought by the really rich people.

417
00:34:50,500 --> 00:34:57,420
They're going to release a cheaper version later. I think that people who have a small apartment and maybe not a lot of room

418
00:34:58,460 --> 00:35:04,460
in this semi-dystopian future we're living in, they might buy this.

419
00:35:04,460 --> 00:35:10,300
It's literally ready player one. Like the real world is just like in shambles, but people go to the metaverse.

420
00:35:10,340 --> 00:35:16,260
It's more like they just don't have enough space for anything else. You're pitching the thing that you were so against.

421
00:35:16,260 --> 00:35:19,860
You're like, this came from snow crash. Like this is like a dystopian idea.

422
00:35:19,860 --> 00:35:26,580
You're pitching it. No, I'm not pitching them to live there. I'm pitching them as like, this is how you have an entertainment system.

423
00:35:26,580 --> 00:35:31,020
This is how you have leisure time after work in a small apartment.

424
00:35:31,180 --> 00:35:35,940
Get a steam deck. But that can't play movies with spatial audio.

425
00:35:35,980 --> 00:35:38,500
Get a steam deck and just tape it to your head. It's the same.

426
00:35:40,180 --> 00:35:45,020
I'm just kidding. It's exactly the same, just as heavy. And this is the same as any other Teclings episode.

427
00:35:45,020 --> 00:35:49,100
It's no different. Just kidding. Hey, we have to end now.

428
00:35:49,100 --> 00:35:52,140
That's we've been going for way too long. This is why we don't do talk links anymore.

429
00:35:52,140 --> 00:35:58,100
Just kidding. We're going to do more talk links. If you like this kind of format, well, I don't want to promise anything.

430
00:35:58,260 --> 00:36:01,260
But the idea is that we're going to do more of these and we're going to do more

431
00:36:01,460 --> 00:36:03,380
on the other channel.

432
00:36:08,060 --> 00:36:10,420
And so thanks for watching.

433
00:36:11,060 --> 00:36:15,260
Leave a comment about your thoughts about what you could have said if you were here

434
00:36:15,260 --> 00:36:17,700
and see you soon. Love you. Love you too.

435
00:36:18,340 --> 00:36:21,820
Oh, you're talking to them. Cut that cut that.