WEBVTT 00:00:00.210 --> 00:00:04.040 Ho, ho, ho! Merry Christmas! Guess what I got you? 00:00:04.500 --> 00:00:04.860 Nothing. 00:00:04.980 --> 00:00:05.860 The WEN Show! 00:00:06.220 --> 00:00:06.440 Yay! 00:00:06.600 --> 00:00:10.060 Welcome, everybody! We've got a lot of great stuff to talk about today. 00:00:10.200 --> 00:00:17.880 John Carmack's decade in VR is over as he exits from Reality Labs, formerly Oculus. 00:00:18.520 --> 00:00:24.060 This actually broke last week, right before the show, so we didn't really get a chance to talk about it, 00:00:24.080 --> 00:00:25.820 but we're going to talk about it this week instead. 00:00:25.820 --> 00:00:30.740 Oh, this is a big one. This is actually the title topic of the show today. 00:00:31.280 --> 00:00:36.000 We got an update from Microsoft on our Windows Modern Standby video, 00:00:36.120 --> 00:00:37.300 where we basically went, 00:00:37.780 --> 00:00:43.740 you guys are ruining Windows laptops with this standby issue where the battery just drains for no reason. 00:00:44.180 --> 00:00:45.760 What the heck is going on over there? 00:00:46.060 --> 00:00:50.720 And we actually, apparently, raised some hell over at Microsoft, 00:00:51.080 --> 00:00:55.720 and Alex from our team managed to get on the phone with the VP of Windows, 00:00:55.820 --> 00:00:59.400 Windows Platform and Services, to go over some of our questions. 00:00:59.540 --> 00:01:03.720 So we're going to be talking about that call, what is going on over there, 00:01:03.980 --> 00:01:05.700 what it is that they're going to do about it. 00:01:05.860 --> 00:01:08.200 Got a whole big update for you guys. What else we got? 00:01:08.580 --> 00:01:13.600 I thought the LastPass breach was in the dock, but I can't find it. 00:01:13.660 --> 00:01:15.900 But we're probably going to talk about that anyways, because it's interesting. 00:01:16.220 --> 00:01:19.580 And also, we have three rapid-fire topics today. 00:01:19.800 --> 00:01:21.860 One is, Eufy admits they lied. 00:01:22.100 --> 00:01:24.980 One is, NVIDIA ends GameStream, recommends Steam Link. 00:01:24.980 --> 00:01:25.800 And another one is, 00:01:25.800 --> 00:01:30.080 facial recognition used to bar a lawyer from entering a venue. 00:01:30.300 --> 00:01:37.780 And the reason why I'm listing all of these is because some amount of them are written by ChatGPT. 00:01:39.100 --> 00:01:42.000 Wait, all the rapid-fires are written by ChatGPT? 00:01:42.040 --> 00:01:42.800 Some amount. 00:01:43.820 --> 00:01:49.100 And you are going to have to guess which ones are written by ChatGPT. 00:01:49.100 --> 00:01:49.980 Oh, no. 00:01:50.040 --> 00:01:51.080 And which ones are written by our team. 00:01:51.200 --> 00:01:56.460 I will say they have been slightly massaged to fit the format of how 00:01:56.460 --> 00:01:56.520 Okay. 00:01:56.540 --> 00:02:03.760 we normally do, but there are lots of, like, whole sentences and stuff that are taken directly from ChatGPT. 00:02:04.660 --> 00:02:05.160 Why? 00:02:05.580 --> 00:02:06.180 Okay. 00:02:06.200 --> 00:02:09.200 So you're going to have to figure out which ones or how many, whatever. 00:02:09.200 --> 00:02:10.740 We'll figure it out when we get there, but yeah. 00:02:10.740 --> 00:02:11.040 Okay. 00:02:15.400 --> 00:02:16.120 It's unlisted. 00:02:16.300 --> 00:02:17.020 It's not on YouTube. 00:02:17.200 --> 00:02:18.460 Who changed it to unlisted? 00:02:19.400 --> 00:02:19.720 Hold on. 00:02:19.760 --> 00:02:20.420 No, no, it's fine. 00:02:20.640 --> 00:02:23.480 I'll just set it to public and then they will see the rest of it later. 00:02:29.680 --> 00:02:30.020 Let's see. 00:02:35.370 --> 00:02:40.230 The show was brought to you by Vessi Footwear and two other things that were there before. 00:02:40.230 --> 00:02:43.670 See Sonic and Zoho One. 00:02:43.950 --> 00:02:44.350 Yes. 00:02:46.940 --> 00:02:47.780 Hold on a second. 00:02:48.080 --> 00:02:48.580 This should go. 00:02:48.660 --> 00:02:49.040 Ah, yes. 00:02:49.140 --> 00:02:49.680 There we go. 00:02:49.900 --> 00:02:50.780 Properly unlisted it. 00:02:50.840 --> 00:02:51.040 Great. 00:02:51.040 --> 00:02:57.000 Let's jump right into our headline topic for the day, which is, of course, that Alex managed 00:02:57.000 --> 00:03:03.040 to get the VP of Windows Platform and Services on the phone to go over some of our concerns 00:03:03.600 --> 00:03:05.780 about Windows Modern Standby. 00:03:06.020 --> 00:03:10.720 First of all, I want to give Microsoft credit because on the one hand, yeah, they've clearly 00:03:10.720 --> 00:03:17.320 sat on ass on this issue for, well, years at this point, but on the other hand, now 00:03:17.320 --> 00:03:23.900 that we have raised it as a problem, now that the community has spoken and made their voices 00:03:23.900 --> 00:03:28.460 heard that this is a problem that affects them day to day, they appear to be taking 00:03:28.460 --> 00:03:30.100 it really seriously. 00:03:30.540 --> 00:03:35.360 So let's start with kind of Alex's interview and go from there. 00:03:35.540 --> 00:03:40.700 First, Alex asked, why is S3 sleep being removed from the system? 00:03:40.700 --> 00:03:46.340 Oh, no, we should give the people a bit of a catch you up if you didn't catch the original 00:03:46.340 --> 00:03:46.660 video. 00:03:46.740 --> 00:03:47.600 Did you watch the video? 00:03:48.740 --> 00:03:49.300 No. 00:03:49.900 --> 00:03:50.200 Okay. 00:03:50.520 --> 00:03:57.640 So Windows Modern Standby or S0 sleep is a connected type of sleep that is meant to replace 00:03:57.640 --> 00:03:59.680 the traditional S3 sleep. 00:03:59.780 --> 00:04:04.720 It's supposed to be connected, more power efficient, and generally a boon. 00:04:04.860 --> 00:04:10.680 It's been brought about in no small part by Intel's push for a more smartphone-like 00:04:10.700 --> 00:04:13.400 experience on Windows laptops. 00:04:14.080 --> 00:04:19.040 The problem is that a lot of the time when the machine is sleeping, I mean, I'm sure 00:04:19.040 --> 00:04:20.140 you've encountered this. 00:04:20.420 --> 00:04:25.840 Have you ever come to your laptop, found it to be piping hot with a dead battery after 00:04:25.840 --> 00:04:28.320 you folded it and put it in your bag? 00:04:28.480 --> 00:04:28.720 Yes. 00:04:29.460 --> 00:04:32.180 I also have like, I'll try to put my desktop to sleep. 00:04:32.760 --> 00:04:33.460 Okay, separate issue. 00:04:33.760 --> 00:04:34.020 Okay. 00:04:34.160 --> 00:04:35.680 I don't want to talk about that for now. 00:04:36.540 --> 00:04:39.360 Oh, I left it in the camera den. 00:04:40.800 --> 00:04:47.760 So, we basically came out and said, we think we figured this out. 00:04:48.120 --> 00:04:52.620 We think it's to do with some kind of, it seems like high performance machines are 00:04:52.620 --> 00:04:53.720 disproportionately affected. 00:04:54.060 --> 00:04:58.680 So, it's something that the machine can be churning away on while it's supposed to be 00:04:58.680 --> 00:04:59.020 sleeping. 00:04:59.340 --> 00:05:05.440 We figured out that by disabling the network connected aspect of this type of sleep on 00:05:05.440 --> 00:05:11.680 a Mac, we were able to get rid of that behavior, which we have also seen on a Mac. 00:05:11.680 --> 00:05:11.700 Okay. 00:05:11.700 --> 00:05:11.780 So, we're going to talk about that. 00:05:11.780 --> 00:05:11.820 So, we're going to talk about that. 00:05:11.820 --> 00:05:11.940 So, we're going to talk about that. 00:05:11.940 --> 00:05:12.220 So, we're going to talk about that. 00:05:12.220 --> 00:05:15.300 Not a Mac, not even an Intel Mac, right? 00:05:15.500 --> 00:05:15.860 Interesting. 00:05:16.060 --> 00:05:21.100 So, it's just a weird quirk of this type of sleep state. 00:05:21.900 --> 00:05:26.380 And we basically made a video calling out Microsoft saying, hey, this has been a problem 00:05:26.380 --> 00:05:28.220 for literally years. 00:05:28.840 --> 00:05:34.140 This cannot be because you already suffer from worse battery life compared to your main 00:05:34.140 --> 00:05:38.500 competitor, Apple, who is gaining market share in the mobile computer space. 00:05:39.020 --> 00:05:41.900 You've got to deal with this because it is killing. 00:05:41.900 --> 00:05:47.040 the experience of using a Windows laptop yeah like i talked to someone like Jake and i'm sitting 00:05:47.040 --> 00:05:52.820 hearing i'm sorry you charge your laptop like once a week that's impossible for me because half the 00:05:52.820 --> 00:05:57.240 time i go to grab my laptop it feels it's probably not half but it it feels like every time i go to 00:05:57.240 --> 00:06:01.320 grab my bloody laptop i might as well flip a coin for whether i'm going to have any battery left 00:06:01.320 --> 00:06:05.280 if you go somewhere without a cable you might as well not even brought the laptop exactly yeah 00:06:05.280 --> 00:06:11.300 exactly so we were trying to light a fire at microsoft and it seems like it worked so the 00:06:11.300 --> 00:06:16.260 first thing alex asked was why is s3 sleep being removed from the BIOS of laptops because that's 00:06:16.260 --> 00:06:22.140 the problem is you couldn't even just say look i don't want s0 i want s3 when there's this industry 00:06:22.140 --> 00:06:29.270 move towards eliminating s3 so here's the answer microsoft is moving away from s3 sleep because 00:06:29.270 --> 00:06:36.010 how each device goes to be because how each device goes to sleep is controlled by that device's 00:06:36.010 --> 00:06:40.850 firmware that means for a device to sleep properly the firmware needs to be updated and 00:06:40.850 --> 00:06:41.410 maintained 00:06:41.410 --> 00:06:47.710 by the company that made said device and as you can probably guess that doesn't happen all the 00:06:47.710 --> 00:06:53.830 time big problem with Windows being put on so many different things by using s0 sleep instead 00:06:53.830 --> 00:07:00.270 microsoft has more control over sleep and has a much higher success rate of everything going to 00:07:00.270 --> 00:07:06.930 sleep properly and waking up properly compared to s3 sleep and i have to admit i was wondering too 00:07:06.930 --> 00:07:11.090 well what was the problem with s3 sleep but then again i also know 00:07:12.210 --> 00:07:16.530 back to your desktop comment that there are plenty of problems with s3 sleep yeah like 00:07:16.530 --> 00:07:22.810 say for example disabling wake on mouse or wake on keyboard in the BIOS and yet having it magically 00:07:22.810 --> 00:07:28.110 wake up if you so much as bump your mouse anyway or just wake up randomly yeah right i had this 00:07:28.110 --> 00:07:33.270 thing for a while where i had to put it to sleep three times every time it would just wake 00:07:33.270 --> 00:07:39.530 back up again like five minutes later and i could finally get it to go down and i had 00:07:39.530 --> 00:07:42.970 why don't you just shut down your computer why don't you just shut down your computer 00:07:42.970 --> 00:07:50.490 if it's an advertised feature of the product no you don't get to complain about me complaining 00:07:50.490 --> 00:07:55.450 about it that is a problem that is objectively a problem and i don't want to hear it 00:07:56.090 --> 00:08:03.620 so so what you turn off your computer i don't give a but if the computer is supposed 00:08:03.620 --> 00:08:11.700 to go to sleep i am well within my right to expect that it will go to sleep okay it's like a child 00:08:11.700 --> 00:08:15.540 right the child is supposed to go to sleep so if it doesn't go to sleep 00:08:15.540 --> 00:08:18.020 well you're well within your right to yell at it and shake it 00:08:22.460 --> 00:08:28.620 obviously kidding obviously kidding i'm trying legal advice i'm trying to make it so people 00:08:28.620 --> 00:08:33.820 don't take me too seriously when i'm going because some people can't tell the difference okay 00:08:35.020 --> 00:08:40.860 all right anyway i also think sometimes it's like the backing into parking spaces thing like you 00:08:40.860 --> 00:08:47.020 might have a lot of time when you are done using said device but you might know that the next time 00:08:47.020 --> 00:08:50.860 that you have to start using it you're going to need to use it quickly but you don't want to just 00:08:51.420 --> 00:08:57.820 let it sit there running the whole time and i guess i get that your needs might not be the 00:08:57.820 --> 00:09:03.740 same as mine but that doesn't make them the only valid needs that too and i'm not saying that your 00:09:03.740 --> 00:09:04.700 way shouldn't be supported 00:09:04.780 --> 00:09:09.420 it's not supported that's the thing i'm not saying well everyone should shut down yeah you 00:09:09.420 --> 00:09:14.380 shouldn't shut down i'm saying you should be able to do both we should have choice like say for 00:09:14.380 --> 00:09:19.980 example there's a lot of really great feedback recently about the micron um facilities tour 00:09:19.980 --> 00:09:25.500 okay okay did you watch it by any chance no but it's it's in my watch later yeah it's really good 00:09:25.500 --> 00:09:29.960 yeah tons of comments basically this is the best video you guys have ever done 00:09:29.960 --> 00:09:34.760 this is far and away the best factory tour i've ever seen it's a really good video micron 00:09:35.240 --> 00:09:42.200 was amazing they really opened up allowed us to see not just see but use the facilities i made 00:09:42.200 --> 00:09:46.840 RAM i said that i saw that thumbnail and immediately added it to my watch later i made 00:09:46.840 --> 00:09:54.410 RAM it was so cool well here's the thing i can't did we just lose power how much ups do we have 00:09:54.410 --> 00:10:00.380 over here uh we need to we need to get power from the main server room ups let's freaking go 00:10:01.180 --> 00:10:05.260 uh we have three minutes okay how much uh okay uh luke entertain the 00:10:05.260 --> 00:10:13.180 people okay uh i don't think we're live though we're live we are live uh okay uh wait no yeah 00:10:13.180 --> 00:10:22.140 we're back hello hi uh it is night time on the land show now with luke how's it going Dan uh who 00:10:22.140 --> 00:10:26.700 usually sits back there behind the tv which i guess you guys don't see but it's also behind 00:10:26.700 --> 00:10:35.080 the camera uh pretty much said three minutes got up and ran uh and Linus also got up and ran we have 00:10:35.320 --> 00:10:43.480 lost power uh both of them are off trying to solve the problem i'm still not 100 certain if 00:10:44.580 --> 00:10:51.210 it's live people are saying f i think we're still sending some data i'm not 100 sure what's going on 00:10:51.210 --> 00:10:57.290 but assuming that this is going to someone right now i'm just gonna i'm just gonna keep going uh 00:10:57.290 --> 00:11:02.570 there's ups is beeping all around the building i'm not 100 certain what you guys can hear 00:11:02.570 --> 00:11:05.690 but we have one very large ups in the server room 00:11:06.490 --> 00:11:12.330 that i think they are going to try to work on i suspect if i had to make some assumptions 00:11:13.210 --> 00:11:17.610 that they are going to be shutting down certain things that are running off of that ups system 00:11:17.610 --> 00:11:22.890 to try to keep networking and whatnot going as long as possible so that we can keep the stream 00:11:22.890 --> 00:11:27.770 going i do believe that is the plan although i can hear them talking right now so theoretically 00:11:27.770 --> 00:11:33.130 that will be coming back soon um i don't know should i give you guys spoilers no i can't because 00:11:33.130 --> 00:11:35.530 then you guys will post them in chat and Linus will know which ones are 00:11:35.930 --> 00:11:39.610 which ones are real and which ones are fake so i won't i won't go through that 00:11:40.250 --> 00:11:47.770 um i don't think i can really complete this um sleep topic so i might jump into another one 00:11:47.770 --> 00:11:53.530 i think the one that i'm going to do is the last pass topic uh because if this 00:11:53.530 --> 00:11:58.170 stream is going out to no one uh that is probably the most okay one to do because 00:11:58.170 --> 00:12:07.530 there are no notes for it in the doc oh hello uh just all the lights coming on what's a good time oh 00:12:08.490 --> 00:12:14.540 this isn't ups running this we just got power back no this is this is ups this is ups okay 00:12:19.460 --> 00:12:25.430 yeah should we turn this off yeah just go for it you're fine there's extreme circumstances yeah we 00:12:25.430 --> 00:12:31.320 can just have a night when show it's fine directly through the notes legendary programmer john carmack 00:12:31.320 --> 00:12:38.440 known for programming the original doom uh and his love for vr has stepped down as consulting cto 00:12:38.440 --> 00:12:43.640 for reality Labs formerly oculus i actually didn't know they were called reality Labs i don't know why 00:12:43.960 --> 00:12:48.120 you would even know already if i didn't know that yeah i think that was a while back yeah i probably 00:12:48.120 --> 00:12:54.360 just didn't care because it's a weird name change that doesn't matter uh meta is famous for making 00:12:54.360 --> 00:13:00.280 and directing and directly breaking promises not to f it up uh in quotes 00:13:00.280 --> 00:13:05.160 you will not need a facebook account to use or develop for the rift that's definitely not a thing 00:13:05.160 --> 00:13:10.680 anymore quotes we are not going to track you flash ads at you or do anything invasive uh that's not 00:13:10.680 --> 00:13:13.960 a thing anymore in quotes we are going to we are not going to lock people out because they'regonica 00:13:14.120 --> 00:13:18.380 compete I actually didn't know that was broken but apparently that was broken in 00:13:18.380 --> 00:13:23.360 2016 yeah and then another one in quotes Facebook is going to give us access to 00:13:23.360 --> 00:13:28.460 massive resources but let us operate independently the first part they did if 00:13:28.460 --> 00:13:36.620 anything I think the entire world quadrupled hex two pulled down yeah the 00:13:36.620 --> 00:13:41.300 first yeah the first half of that is extremely correct and then in quotes 00:13:41.300 --> 00:13:45.800 none of our gaming resources will be diverted oh yeah that one uh not so much 00:13:45.800 --> 00:13:51.240 uh Carmack says that he has mixed feelings about leaving stating that the quest two in particular 00:13:51.240 --> 00:13:56.460 was almost exactly what he wanted to see despite complaints about the software yeah the proverbial 00:13:56.460 --> 00:14:00.940 straw that broke the camel's back is apparently the the gaming resources being diverted one for 00:14:00.940 --> 00:14:06.480 him I mean we know yeah John Carmack you know he's a gamer he's not a he's not a gamer he's 00:14:06.480 --> 00:14:11.060 not a game he's not into gaming right right John Carmack not not that into gaming just 00:14:11.060 --> 00:14:11.280 a 00:14:11.280 --> 00:14:18.060 Doom yeah it's not a game yeah yeah it's a wall it's real it's a wall painting it's how we protect 00:14:18.060 --> 00:14:25.560 the world from demons it's training you know the storyline behind Doom is like surprisingly in 00:14:25.560 --> 00:14:30.540 depth yeah it's like there's a ton of lore yeah I had no idea yeah I mean either anyway uh Carmack 00:14:30.540 --> 00:14:34.920 has previously been critical of meta's direction saying that they should focus on products to tap 00:14:34.920 --> 00:14:39.900 into the metaverse before building out initiatives uh he worried that thousands of people's efforts 00:14:39.900 --> 00:14:41.040 spanning years would be spent 00:14:41.040 --> 00:14:46.080 on things that didn't contribute to the way people use devices today seems to be a little 00:14:46.080 --> 00:14:51.600 bit true his biggest problem however is the efficiency and speed of development he says 00:14:51.600 --> 00:14:57.900 that as someone who works hard at optimization seeing gross inefficiency hurts your soul likening 00:14:57.900 --> 00:15:05.280 to seeing five percent GPU utilization that is not surprising from him he has always been hyper into 00:15:05.280 --> 00:15:10.320 that uh this is one of the reasons why people still run some of his old games on like as many devices 00:15:11.040 --> 00:15:15.540 as you can imagine because they're really really well built for for optimization for regard like 00:15:15.540 --> 00:15:19.860 basically regardless of what platform you're on reality Labs he says operates at half the 00:15:19.860 --> 00:15:28.080 effectiveness that he'd like yikes that's a big I mean his standards are pretty high yes but there's 00:15:28.080 --> 00:15:34.080 probably still room for improvement also yes um his voice at the top of the company to his dismay 00:15:34.080 --> 00:15:40.380 has not been able to persuade the organization to improve he says uh that he has never been able to 00:15:40.380 --> 00:15:40.980 stop 00:15:41.040 --> 00:15:47.580 stupid things because they cause damage or set a direction and have the team stick to it he blames 00:15:47.580 --> 00:15:53.460 himself for this as instead of taking a leadership role and locking horns with Facebook on day one he 00:15:53.460 --> 00:15:59.160 focused on what he's best at programming that's also not surprising he assumed he would hate it 00:15:59.160 --> 00:16:04.740 be bad at it and probably lose anyways so that's why he stuck to programming he still deeply 00:16:04.740 --> 00:16:10.740 believes in VR and that meta is best able to show its value his parting advice in quotes 00:16:11.040 --> 00:16:19.140 is make better decisions and fill your products with give a damn now me too actually Carmex Focus 00:16:19.140 --> 00:16:25.080 will be on his artificial intelligence startup Keen Technologies which has received significant 00:16:25.080 --> 00:16:31.620 investment money in recent months artificial intelligence or AGI has the goal of making an 00:16:31.620 --> 00:16:38.880 artificial intelligence system that can theoretically do any task a human can a truer definition of AI 00:16:41.230 --> 00:16:46.270 far more limited in scope and off and is often just a matter of observe and fail at one thing 00:16:46.270 --> 00:16:52.750 until it gets better some like meta chief scientist yan lee hopefully i said that right i 00:16:52.750 --> 00:16:59.550 don't know sorry if i did say that wrong uh doubt that agi can or will ever become a reality others 00:16:59.550 --> 00:17:06.030 fear what agi could represent if created irresponsibly the ai overloads overlords 00:17:06.030 --> 00:17:16.510 joke hits a little differently for agi now what i kind of want to raise here uh is i think ai or agi 00:17:16.510 --> 00:17:24.110 or whatever is what a lot of people definitely including myself thought vr was going to be at 00:17:24.110 --> 00:17:28.830 this point in time yeah i think it's a huge disruptor i think it's going to change a ton 00:17:28.830 --> 00:17:34.990 of things i think it already has and the real usable levels of it have barely even existed yet 00:17:36.190 --> 00:17:43.790 when gpt4 comes out if places like google who have large language models similar to gp3 gpt4 00:17:43.790 --> 00:17:48.750 whatever if they start using those more publicly if other companies that have similar systems start 00:17:48.750 --> 00:17:53.230 using those more publicly i think the impact of these things are going to be on the scale 00:17:53.870 --> 00:17:58.910 that when oculus was first founded people thought the impact of vr was going to be at 00:17:59.710 --> 00:18:05.090 so i think it is a much more significantly interesting thing to work on right now 00:18:05.810 --> 00:18:06.290 and i think 00:18:06.450 --> 00:18:13.730 carmack is is quite interested in leading his own things considering that the vast amount of his 00:18:15.280 --> 00:18:22.320 frustrations very clearly when leaving meta um was leadership decisions sure and and 00:18:22.880 --> 00:18:26.720 efficiencies and goals and all that type of stuff so if he can steer the ship more directly 00:18:26.720 --> 00:18:30.880 and he can do it on something that might be more punchy and more fun right now this is one of those 00:18:30.880 --> 00:18:36.000 things where i've i think i've talked to you about this like not on the show just talking um i don't 00:18:36.000 --> 00:18:41.680 know how i would handle working for someone else yeah as long as they made decisions that i agreed 00:18:41.680 --> 00:18:49.220 were really great it'd be fine but the second but they probably won't yeah and it's not going to be 00:18:49.220 --> 00:18:56.420 fine i i i think it's really hard to and the thing is that i like to think that i try pretty 00:18:56.420 --> 00:19:00.980 hard to reach consensus when we make a decision as a company um i have never experienced that anywhere else and i suspect that let me add to that midterm studies and career research stuff of people that have tried to trust their perspective as a company 00:19:00.980 --> 00:19:01.320 that have tried to trust their expertise as a company i 00:19:01.320 --> 00:19:02.400 recently wrote i think one thing is işi did a really good job when i did my paper for 00:19:02.400 --> 00:19:05.040 i did funny supporters so years this was really hard to for careers i wrote these standards general 00:19:05.040 --> 00:19:10.240 i suspect that is not very common and i suspect that even as i'm talking about this and you're 00:19:10.240 --> 00:19:17.640 sitting there nodding i'm not always perfect at it um but no but there's a reason i'm still here too 00:19:17.640 --> 00:19:22.640 i don't know i just i don't think i would i don't think i would find i wouldn't need to agree with 00:19:22.640 --> 00:19:27.340 everything but i don't think i would find a place where i would agree with enough and i think that's 00:19:27.340 --> 00:19:31.040 basically what he's run into here i've said this literally on the WAN Show before like i don't 00:19:31.040 --> 00:19:36.340 necessarily agree with everything we've ever done but i think that would be basically impossible 00:19:36.340 --> 00:19:42.740 um and it's fine and i think i i do agree with the vast majority of things that we've done 00:19:42.740 --> 00:19:49.130 um wow i want to give her a little more juice way less than i thought 00:19:49.130 --> 00:19:54.310 all right good enough nice i do agree with the vast majority of things that we've done 00:19:54.310 --> 00:19:58.470 and even when i don't agree with what we've done i can usually at least see the logic behind it 00:19:58.470 --> 00:20:02.210 i have worked places before where tons of things happen where 00:20:02.210 --> 00:20:02.810 i 00:20:02.830 --> 00:20:07.890 no matter how hard i try i can't find the logic behind it uh the logic behind why the show is 00:20:07.890 --> 00:20:12.810 dark today by the way if you guys are joining us a little bit late here we're going to try to splice 00:20:12.810 --> 00:20:18.890 together the the segments of the show uh but we were interrupted by a power outage we are going 00:20:18.890 --> 00:20:24.310 to run on battery for as long as we can here guys but the show might be a little bit on the shorter 00:20:24.310 --> 00:20:28.770 side which means i want to jump through our sponsor spots right away to make sure that hey 00:20:28.770 --> 00:20:32.490 at least they're getting their money's worth here and they don't ask for a refund uh the show is 00:20:32.490 --> 00:20:32.810 brought to you by the show's sponsor sponsor sponsor sponsor sponsor sponsor sponsor sponsor 00:20:32.830 --> 00:20:33.330 sponsor sponsor sponsor sponsor sponsor sponsor sponsor sponsor sponsor sponsor 00:20:33.330 --> 00:20:40.130 csonic jim's prime tx 1600 watt power supply is a great choice for high performance system look 00:20:41.090 --> 00:20:46.570 i'm not going to not get through the sponsor spots okay we i i was brought in on my friday 00:20:46.570 --> 00:20:53.210 i'm supposed to be on vacation this week darn it we are doing the lawn show it features an 80 plus 00:20:53.210 --> 00:20:58.530 titanium rating which means that less power gets wasted during power conversion uh Dan do you have 00:20:58.530 --> 00:21:02.970 the sponsor lower thirds oh they're on the server aren't they okay we're living without them today 00:21:02.990 --> 00:21:07.490 As I say, Seasonic's experience in designing hardware shows in their hybrid mode, a fan 00:21:07.490 --> 00:21:13.330 control option that enables users to keep their power supply silent, and they back their 00:21:13.330 --> 00:21:15.810 PSUs up with up to a 12-year warranty. 00:21:15.810 --> 00:21:19.010 So if you're building a new system and looking for a power supply, check out what Seasonic 00:21:19.010 --> 00:21:22.690 has to offer at Seasonic.com or at the link down below. 00:21:22.690 --> 00:21:25.050 The show is also brought to you by Zoho One. 00:21:25.050 --> 00:21:28.670 If you run a business, you know how hard it is to keep everything organized, but Zoho 00:21:28.670 --> 00:21:33.610 One is designed to help you run your entire business through a single, unified platform. 00:21:33.610 --> 00:21:37.970 Replace your patchwork of cloud applications, legacy tools, and paper-based processes with 00:21:37.970 --> 00:21:42.550 one operating system with Zoho One, and they'll help you build your company's presence across 00:21:42.550 --> 00:21:46.930 marketing channels, send prospects the right messages, and measure ROI with out-of-the-box 00:21:46.930 --> 00:21:47.930 insights. 00:21:47.930 --> 00:21:51.870 They have a comprehensive set of account tools to organize your business finances, track 00:21:51.870 --> 00:21:55.770 payables, manage bills and expense, and even monitor your business's financial health, 00:21:55.770 --> 00:21:58.610 so whether it's sales, marketing, finance, or analytics. 00:21:58.610 --> 00:22:01.010 Support Zoho One has got you covered. 00:22:01.010 --> 00:22:04.850 Sign up today using the link below and get a free 30-day trial with no credit card required. 00:22:04.850 --> 00:22:07.670 Finally, the show is brought to you by Vessi Footwear. 00:22:07.670 --> 00:22:12.710 Vessi Footwear claims their shoes are 100% waterproof, and I've yet to get any snow through 00:22:12.710 --> 00:22:18.010 the ones that I was wearing today in the snow. 00:22:18.010 --> 00:22:21.710 Their dual-climate knit material keeps your feet warm during winter and cool during the 00:22:21.710 --> 00:22:22.710 summer. 00:22:22.710 --> 00:22:26.550 They're super easy to slip on and off, comfortable for traveling, fit almost any occasion. 00:22:26.550 --> 00:22:27.550 Oh, look. 00:22:27.550 --> 00:22:28.550 There's a point in time. 00:22:28.550 --> 00:22:30.390 There's a point in here that says, some of us are wearing them now. 00:22:30.390 --> 00:22:31.390 Haha, like me. 00:22:31.390 --> 00:22:36.370 Also, they're 100% vegan, so get $25 off each pair with offer code WANSHOW. 00:22:36.370 --> 00:22:38.230 You can check them out at Vessi.com slash WANSHOW. 00:22:38.230 --> 00:22:40.450 I've actually been wearing them quite a bit lately. 00:22:40.450 --> 00:22:44.850 I forgot to buy new sandals, or rather, I was too lazy to buy new sandals for kind of 00:22:44.850 --> 00:22:50.550 an extended period, and so I started wearing the Vessis, and it's a hard habit to break. 00:22:50.550 --> 00:22:53.330 They're like, they're all right. 00:22:53.330 --> 00:22:57.990 You know, my girlfriend bought Vessis without realizing that they were a sponsor of us. 00:22:57.990 --> 00:22:58.550 Yeah. 00:22:58.550 --> 00:23:00.310 Did she even get the discount? 00:23:00.310 --> 00:23:01.990 No, I don't think so. 00:23:01.990 --> 00:23:06.030 And she, I didn't know that she even had them, and she was talking about how much she liked 00:23:06.030 --> 00:23:10.230 her shoes because no water got through them, and I was like, oh, we have a sponsor that 00:23:10.230 --> 00:23:12.510 makes like highly water resistant shoes. 00:23:12.510 --> 00:23:13.510 They're called Vessi. 00:23:13.510 --> 00:23:14.510 She's like, oh, I have Vessis. 00:23:14.510 --> 00:23:15.510 I was like, what? 00:23:15.510 --> 00:23:16.640 Small world. 00:23:16.640 --> 00:23:17.640 How did this happen? 00:23:17.640 --> 00:23:19.640 But yeah, it's actually, that's actually a true story. 00:23:19.640 --> 00:23:22.690 What do you want to talk about? 00:23:22.690 --> 00:23:28.350 I want to get through these rapid fire topics because I want to see if you can sniff out. 00:23:28.350 --> 00:23:29.350 Sure. 00:23:29.350 --> 00:23:33.070 Which one of them was written by ChatGPT. 00:23:33.070 --> 00:23:37.670 So first, do you want me to read them and you can read through the notes and think about 00:23:37.670 --> 00:23:38.670 it? 00:23:38.670 --> 00:23:39.670 Or how do you want to do this? 00:23:39.670 --> 00:23:40.670 Let's just do it like we normally would. 00:23:40.670 --> 00:23:41.670 You know, I'll do one, you do one. 00:23:41.670 --> 00:23:42.670 Let's get through all three of them. 00:23:42.670 --> 00:23:43.670 Sure. 00:23:43.670 --> 00:23:44.670 And then I'll do my best. 00:23:44.670 --> 00:23:45.670 Okay. 00:23:45.670 --> 00:23:48.810 First up, we've got Eufy admits they lied. 00:23:48.810 --> 00:23:53.470 This has been a developing story over, man, like a month now, hasn't it? 00:23:53.470 --> 00:23:58.030 In a blog post addressed to Eufy security customers and partners. 00:23:58.030 --> 00:23:59.030 Anchor. 00:23:59.030 --> 00:24:03.890 The parent company of Eufy admitted to using the cloud to send mobile push notifications 00:24:03.890 --> 00:24:08.030 with small preview images, which are protected by end-to-end encryption and deleted shortly 00:24:08.030 --> 00:24:10.210 after being sent. 00:24:10.210 --> 00:24:15.730 The company also admitted to a security flaw in the live view feature on its web portal, 00:24:15.730 --> 00:24:21.590 but denied that any user data had been exposed or that facial recognition data was sent to 00:24:21.590 --> 00:24:22.590 the cloud. 00:24:22.590 --> 00:24:27.730 Eufy has made changes to the feature to require users to log into the web portal in order 00:24:27.730 --> 00:24:28.790 to view live streams. 00:24:28.790 --> 00:24:35.110 The company also said that it is committed to reducing the use of the cloud in its security 00:24:35.110 --> 00:24:43.360 processes wherever possible, and that it complies with all industry standards. 00:24:43.360 --> 00:24:47.560 Discussion question here is how much does an incident like this really tarnish a brand 00:24:47.560 --> 00:24:48.560 or its bottom line? 00:24:48.560 --> 00:24:49.560 I don't know. 00:24:49.560 --> 00:24:50.560 It depends how mainstream it is. 00:24:50.560 --> 00:24:51.560 I think it varies a lot. 00:24:51.560 --> 00:24:52.560 Yeah. 00:24:52.560 --> 00:24:53.560 Yeah. 00:24:53.560 --> 00:24:57.860 I think it depends how mainstream the reporting on the negativity surrounding it is. 00:24:57.860 --> 00:24:59.360 How much competition there is in the space. 00:24:59.360 --> 00:25:00.360 That too. 00:25:00.360 --> 00:25:04.780 You can talk day in and day out about what a toxic company NVIDIA might be, or Apple 00:25:04.780 --> 00:25:08.120 might be, and it's not going to stop people from buying their products. 00:25:08.120 --> 00:25:09.120 Absolutely. 00:25:09.120 --> 00:25:10.120 Yeah. 00:25:10.120 --> 00:25:15.440 Whereas Eufy, I feel like what did not have as strong of a brand to begin with, and so 00:25:15.440 --> 00:25:20.000 much of the strength of their brand, at least based on the messages I'm seeing about it, 00:25:20.000 --> 00:25:24.680 was around that promise that they didn't upload anything to the cloud. 00:25:24.680 --> 00:25:28.680 So yeah, I could see it being extremely damaging. 00:25:28.680 --> 00:25:29.640 And there's quite a few competitors. 00:25:29.640 --> 00:25:29.680 Yeah. 00:25:29.680 --> 00:25:32.380 There's quite a few competitors, and there's competitors that are bigger names. 00:25:32.380 --> 00:25:34.920 So this could be a hugely negative impact. 00:25:34.920 --> 00:25:35.920 Kind of an underdog. 00:25:35.920 --> 00:25:36.920 Yeah. 00:25:36.920 --> 00:25:37.920 Yeah. 00:25:37.920 --> 00:25:41.320 Our second discussion question is, if you became CEO of this company one week before 00:25:41.320 --> 00:25:46.160 the revelations, I hope the AI wrote this discussion question because this is a great 00:25:46.160 --> 00:25:47.340 discussion question. 00:25:47.340 --> 00:25:50.440 I suspect it was James who wrote this discussion question, though. 00:25:50.440 --> 00:25:52.180 I think, but I don't remember. 00:25:52.180 --> 00:25:55.440 I think all the discussion questions might be people. 00:25:55.440 --> 00:25:59.440 I had a meeting with Riley and James this week about sort of... 00:25:59.440 --> 00:26:03.940 Because we added, Luke and I added a bunch of topics to the doc right before the show 00:26:03.940 --> 00:26:05.440 went live last week. 00:26:05.440 --> 00:26:07.940 And Riley sent me the world's saddest email. 00:26:07.940 --> 00:26:08.940 It was pretty sad. 00:26:08.940 --> 00:26:09.940 Being like, you know... 00:26:09.940 --> 00:26:10.940 We work really hard. 00:26:10.940 --> 00:26:11.940 On these topics. 00:26:11.940 --> 00:26:17.940 It would be really nice to know if you're just like, would prefer other topics. 00:26:17.940 --> 00:26:21.060 And I'm like, oh, Riley, I'm sorry. 00:26:21.060 --> 00:26:22.060 It's not you. 00:26:22.060 --> 00:26:23.060 It's me. 00:26:23.060 --> 00:26:26.440 Let's have a meeting next week and kind of talk about why we changed them. 00:26:26.440 --> 00:26:28.440 And one of the things that wasn't just like me. 00:26:28.440 --> 00:26:29.440 Yeah. 00:26:29.440 --> 00:26:30.440 I know. 00:26:30.440 --> 00:26:31.440 Laying down an edict or whatever. 00:26:31.440 --> 00:26:36.020 But one of the things that came out of our discussion, you're a genius, Jake. 00:26:36.020 --> 00:26:37.020 He's got a... 00:26:37.020 --> 00:26:38.020 Jackery. 00:26:38.020 --> 00:26:39.020 A Jackery. 00:26:39.020 --> 00:26:40.020 Yeah. 00:26:40.020 --> 00:26:41.020 Speaking of... 00:26:41.020 --> 00:26:42.020 There's five? 00:26:42.020 --> 00:26:43.020 We're streaming WAN Show. 00:26:43.020 --> 00:26:44.020 Let's go. 00:26:44.020 --> 00:26:45.020 Heck yeah, Jake. 00:26:45.020 --> 00:26:46.020 All right. 00:26:46.020 --> 00:26:48.080 Do it. 00:26:48.080 --> 00:26:49.080 Wait. 00:26:49.080 --> 00:26:50.080 What were we talking about? 00:26:50.080 --> 00:26:51.080 Now, right. 00:26:51.080 --> 00:26:52.080 Yeah. 00:26:52.080 --> 00:26:58.500 So one of the things we came to together was that part of choosing a good show, you know, 00:26:58.500 --> 00:26:59.500 is... 00:26:59.500 --> 00:27:04.460 Choosing a good topic is looking at what the discussion topics will be. 00:27:04.460 --> 00:27:08.080 Because if the discussion topic is, is this bad? 00:27:08.080 --> 00:27:09.080 Yeah. 00:27:09.080 --> 00:27:10.140 Yes. 00:27:10.140 --> 00:27:12.640 Then there's nothing to really talk about. 00:27:12.640 --> 00:27:13.640 Yeah. 00:27:13.640 --> 00:27:14.640 Yeah. 00:27:14.640 --> 00:27:15.640 It's bad. 00:27:15.640 --> 00:27:16.640 We need some back and forth. 00:27:16.640 --> 00:27:17.640 Okay. 00:27:17.640 --> 00:27:18.640 Well, but why is it bad? 00:27:18.640 --> 00:27:19.640 How is it bad? 00:27:19.640 --> 00:27:20.640 Who was bad? 00:27:20.640 --> 00:27:21.640 Where was it bad? 00:27:21.640 --> 00:27:22.640 We've got to be able to... 00:27:22.640 --> 00:27:23.640 There's got to be some meat on the boat. 00:27:23.640 --> 00:27:24.640 There's got to be a discussion in the discussion question. 00:27:24.640 --> 00:27:25.640 Yeah. 00:27:25.640 --> 00:27:27.140 And so what I'm noticing is our discussion topics. 00:27:27.140 --> 00:27:28.140 Yeah. 00:27:28.140 --> 00:27:32.820 Our discussion questions are so much better because I think we're choosing topics based 00:27:32.820 --> 00:27:35.760 on how rich the discussion can be. 00:27:35.760 --> 00:27:36.760 Yeah. 00:27:36.760 --> 00:27:41.560 If you wanted to truly make things right, if you were the CEO of this company one week 00:27:41.560 --> 00:27:46.440 before this happened, so you can't alter course, all you can do is react to it, what would 00:27:46.440 --> 00:27:47.440 you have done differently? 00:27:47.440 --> 00:27:51.980 So I actually vaguely referenced this on the last show that we talked about, Yuffie, which 00:27:51.980 --> 00:27:53.940 I don't think was our last show. 00:27:53.940 --> 00:27:55.720 I think it was two shows ago or something. 00:27:55.720 --> 00:27:57.720 And this might tank the company. 00:27:57.720 --> 00:28:02.340 But what I said was they effectively had to recall devices. 00:28:02.340 --> 00:28:05.380 And I still kind of defend that. 00:28:05.380 --> 00:28:06.380 And yeah, it might tank the company. 00:28:06.380 --> 00:28:07.380 I don't know. 00:28:07.380 --> 00:28:11.140 But they advertised on local only. 00:28:11.140 --> 00:28:12.680 It is not local only. 00:28:12.680 --> 00:28:15.700 They're not going to be able to change the... 00:28:15.700 --> 00:28:16.700 Maybe you can. 00:28:16.700 --> 00:28:17.700 I doubt it. 00:28:17.700 --> 00:28:19.700 I don't think they're going to be able to change that. 00:28:19.700 --> 00:28:20.800 Certainly not immediately. 00:28:20.800 --> 00:28:22.420 So they need to... 00:28:22.420 --> 00:28:25.340 So maybe another option is offer full refunds. 00:28:25.340 --> 00:28:26.340 Yes. 00:28:26.340 --> 00:28:27.340 Yes. 00:28:27.340 --> 00:28:29.040 They're explaining everything that's going on. 00:28:29.040 --> 00:28:32.010 Be very transparent. 00:28:32.010 --> 00:28:33.710 Admit the things you got to admit. 00:28:33.710 --> 00:28:34.710 Offer a full refund. 00:28:34.710 --> 00:28:35.710 Yeah. 00:28:35.710 --> 00:28:36.710 And if the user doesn't take it, they don't take it. 00:28:36.710 --> 00:28:37.710 But like... 00:28:37.710 --> 00:28:46.280 So the CEO in me would be trying to avoid a full, we refund everything. 00:28:46.280 --> 00:28:47.280 Yeah. 00:28:47.280 --> 00:28:48.280 Yeah. 00:28:48.280 --> 00:28:49.280 So I think you have to do the offer. 00:28:49.280 --> 00:28:50.280 That's kind of the end. 00:28:50.280 --> 00:28:51.280 Yeah. 00:28:51.280 --> 00:28:52.280 You just tank the whole company. 00:28:52.280 --> 00:28:53.280 Yeah. 00:28:53.280 --> 00:28:54.280 You might as well just say, see you later. 00:28:54.280 --> 00:28:55.280 Yeah. 00:28:55.280 --> 00:28:56.280 At that point. 00:28:56.280 --> 00:28:57.840 And I don't mean like as an FU to the customer. 00:28:57.840 --> 00:28:59.220 That that would be the right thing to do. 00:28:59.220 --> 00:29:01.600 I mean, you just might not survive it. 00:29:01.600 --> 00:29:06.420 You just spent so much money on R&D, you spent so much money on tooling, you spent so much 00:29:06.420 --> 00:29:09.800 money on manufacturing, you spent so much money on shipping, now you have to pay for 00:29:09.800 --> 00:29:10.800 more shipping. 00:29:10.800 --> 00:29:11.800 Yeah. 00:29:11.800 --> 00:29:12.800 To take it all back. 00:29:12.800 --> 00:29:13.800 And you didn't gain anything. 00:29:13.800 --> 00:29:14.800 Yeah. 00:29:14.800 --> 00:29:21.700 So what I would be trying to do is offer that option because you kind of have to, but I 00:29:21.700 --> 00:29:26.840 would be trying to come up with a more compelling option that doesn't hurt me quite so much. 00:29:26.840 --> 00:29:27.840 Yeah. 00:29:27.840 --> 00:29:28.840 Right? 00:29:28.840 --> 00:29:36.120 So I might be looking at, okay, if I can convince you to keep this in its current state and 00:29:36.120 --> 00:29:41.820 I can send you the new working one when we get there, can we do that? 00:29:41.820 --> 00:29:42.820 Or I would be looking for- 00:29:42.820 --> 00:29:45.720 I don't know if there's a subscription, but maybe you give them six months for free or 00:29:45.720 --> 00:29:46.720 something. 00:29:46.720 --> 00:29:47.720 Yeah. 00:29:47.720 --> 00:29:52.520 If I could keep this in its state for now, but I could get you to what we promised in 00:29:52.520 --> 00:29:55.180 six months, can you accept that? 00:29:55.180 --> 00:29:56.800 I'd be trying to look for... 00:29:56.800 --> 00:30:01.680 Ultimately, right, what the customer wanted was that product. 00:30:01.680 --> 00:30:02.680 Yeah. 00:30:02.680 --> 00:30:08.360 So what I would be trying to figure out is, is there any way without taking back everything 00:30:08.360 --> 00:30:10.840 to get you what you paid for? 00:30:10.840 --> 00:30:13.420 Well, there is some problems with that due to- 00:30:13.420 --> 00:30:14.420 I know. 00:30:14.420 --> 00:30:15.420 But- 00:30:15.420 --> 00:30:16.420 You already broke the trust. 00:30:16.420 --> 00:30:17.420 Yeah. 00:30:17.420 --> 00:30:19.680 So you have to throw in a bonus because you have to do more than just get them what they 00:30:19.680 --> 00:30:20.680 paid for. 00:30:20.680 --> 00:30:21.680 Well, there's some technical problems with that too. 00:30:21.680 --> 00:30:22.680 For sure. 00:30:22.680 --> 00:30:25.680 Getting notifications to local phones or remote phones, all this type of stuff. 00:30:25.680 --> 00:30:26.680 For sure. 00:30:26.680 --> 00:30:29.220 I understand the core idea of what you're saying. 00:30:29.220 --> 00:30:34.520 But I'd be trying to look for a way to kind of go, okay, it's going to take us some time. 00:30:34.520 --> 00:30:38.740 We're going to have to do this to make it up to you, some kind of partial refund or 00:30:38.740 --> 00:30:39.740 some kind... 00:30:39.740 --> 00:30:42.460 Which is often not actually possible. 00:30:42.460 --> 00:30:46.920 You ran into this a little while ago where you were not able to issue someone a partial 00:30:46.920 --> 00:30:49.740 refund through PayPal because it had been 180 days. 00:30:49.740 --> 00:30:51.680 They requested far past a reasonable date. 00:30:51.680 --> 00:30:52.680 Yeah. 00:30:52.680 --> 00:30:53.680 Yeah. 00:30:53.680 --> 00:30:54.680 And PayPal literally wouldn't allow Luke to do it because I guess the assumption from their point of view... 00:30:54.680 --> 00:30:55.680 Yeah. 00:30:55.680 --> 00:30:56.680 Yeah. 00:30:56.680 --> 00:30:57.680 ...is that it must be under duress. 00:30:57.680 --> 00:30:58.680 I don't know. 00:30:58.680 --> 00:30:59.680 Yeah. 00:30:59.680 --> 00:31:00.680 Right? 00:31:00.680 --> 00:31:01.680 Yeah. 00:31:01.680 --> 00:31:05.580 I think their thing is they don't want to deal with... 00:31:05.580 --> 00:31:06.660 Because I think if you... 00:31:06.660 --> 00:31:11.380 If I remember correctly, if you do a refund within the terms, the fees and whatnot get 00:31:11.380 --> 00:31:12.380 refunded as well. 00:31:12.380 --> 00:31:13.380 Right. 00:31:13.380 --> 00:31:16.440 And there can be accounting challenges for everyone up and down the chain, right? 00:31:16.440 --> 00:31:17.440 Yes. 00:31:17.440 --> 00:31:18.440 Yeah. 00:31:18.440 --> 00:31:23.400 Because if you have already remitted the taxes you collected, let me tell you something. 00:31:23.400 --> 00:31:24.740 The state of California ain't going to be given a refund. 00:31:24.740 --> 00:31:27.500 Ain't going to be giving you back those taxes you remitted. 00:31:27.500 --> 00:31:28.500 Yeah. 00:31:28.500 --> 00:31:29.500 No chance. 00:31:29.500 --> 00:31:31.500 No matter who you refunded, whatever you refunded to. 00:31:31.500 --> 00:31:32.500 Yeah. 00:31:32.500 --> 00:31:33.500 So there's challenges. 00:31:33.500 --> 00:31:34.500 So you're just eating it. 00:31:34.500 --> 00:31:35.500 Yeah. 00:31:35.500 --> 00:31:37.500 Well, I mean, even if you just eat it, the reporting for that would be a nightmare. 00:31:37.500 --> 00:31:39.740 I don't even know how you would account for it. 00:31:39.740 --> 00:31:40.740 Right? 00:31:40.740 --> 00:31:41.740 Yeah. 00:31:41.740 --> 00:31:42.740 So it's a nightmare. 00:31:42.740 --> 00:31:47.320 So, yeah, I'd be trying to look for a compromise, but I agree with you. 00:31:47.320 --> 00:31:48.500 You don't have a choice. 00:31:48.500 --> 00:31:49.500 You have to offer the option. 00:31:49.500 --> 00:31:50.500 You have to do something. 00:31:50.500 --> 00:31:51.500 Yeah. 00:31:51.500 --> 00:31:52.500 You have to offer the option. 00:31:52.500 --> 00:31:53.500 And a bunch of people are going to take it. 00:31:53.500 --> 00:31:54.500 Yeah. 00:31:54.500 --> 00:32:00.480 If you are sincere and you are open, and this time you're honest, you might have a solid 00:32:00.480 --> 00:32:02.680 amount of people that don't run. 00:32:02.680 --> 00:32:03.680 But they didn't do that. 00:32:03.680 --> 00:32:04.680 They did not. 00:32:04.680 --> 00:32:06.020 They've taken too long. 00:32:06.020 --> 00:32:10.720 And honestly, this response seems kind of half-baked as far as I'm concerned. 00:32:10.720 --> 00:32:13.960 Someone just needs to sue the trash out of them. 00:32:13.960 --> 00:32:14.960 They're not going to be successful. 00:32:14.960 --> 00:32:16.190 It's a Chinese company. 00:32:16.190 --> 00:32:17.190 Oh, right. 00:32:17.190 --> 00:32:18.190 What are they going to do? 00:32:18.190 --> 00:32:19.190 Yeah. 00:32:19.190 --> 00:32:20.190 Fair enough. 00:32:20.190 --> 00:32:21.190 Nothing. 00:32:21.190 --> 00:32:22.190 Like China's going to protect their own. 00:32:22.190 --> 00:32:23.190 Get them banned from selling. 00:32:23.190 --> 00:32:23.690 Yeah. 00:32:23.730 --> 00:32:24.730 So what? 00:32:24.730 --> 00:32:25.730 The States or something. 00:32:25.730 --> 00:32:26.730 Yeah. 00:32:26.730 --> 00:32:32.450 And so I just, from my point of view, Anchor's on our list at this point, which is unfortunate. 00:32:32.450 --> 00:32:34.230 We really enjoyed working with them actually. 00:32:34.230 --> 00:32:35.230 I really liked Anchor. 00:32:35.230 --> 00:32:36.230 I genuinely liked the products. 00:32:36.230 --> 00:32:37.230 Yeah. 00:32:37.230 --> 00:32:38.230 Me too. 00:32:38.230 --> 00:32:44.490 So like, it sucks because finding good long-term sponsor partners is not something 00:32:44.490 --> 00:32:45.670 that's easy. 00:32:45.670 --> 00:32:48.850 And I feel for the poor sales team here, right? 00:32:48.850 --> 00:32:52.310 Because when I just rug pull them and I go, hey, yeah, that account that you've been handling, 00:32:52.310 --> 00:32:53.190 that's doing. 00:32:53.190 --> 00:32:54.870 It's over many thousands of dollars a year. 00:32:54.870 --> 00:32:55.870 Guess what? 00:32:55.870 --> 00:32:58.290 You're not working with them anymore by edict of the king. 00:32:58.290 --> 00:32:59.290 Like that sucks. 00:32:59.290 --> 00:33:00.290 Right? 00:33:00.290 --> 00:33:01.290 Oh, it does. 00:33:01.290 --> 00:33:02.290 Yeah. 00:33:02.290 --> 00:33:03.290 Absolutely. 00:33:03.290 --> 00:33:04.290 Like imagine you worked in sales somewhere, right? 00:33:04.290 --> 00:33:07.690 Your boss comes into the room and says, yeah, certain quotas and all this type of stuff. 00:33:07.690 --> 00:33:08.690 Yeah. 00:33:08.690 --> 00:33:11.650 That car that's on the lot, you can't sell that car anymore. 00:33:11.650 --> 00:33:16.210 Or like you can't work with, you know, I don't know, families. 00:33:16.210 --> 00:33:20.690 Anytime a family walks on the lot, you can't sell them anymore or whatever it is. 00:33:20.690 --> 00:33:21.690 Right. 00:33:21.690 --> 00:33:22.650 Kind of frustrating. 00:33:22.650 --> 00:33:23.650 Like that sucks. 00:33:23.650 --> 00:33:24.650 What? 00:33:24.650 --> 00:33:25.650 I just let them walk by. 00:33:25.650 --> 00:33:26.650 Frustrating the whole way down the chain. 00:33:26.650 --> 00:33:27.650 I just let them walk by. 00:33:27.650 --> 00:33:28.650 I got quotas to hit. 00:33:28.650 --> 00:33:29.650 Right? 00:33:29.650 --> 00:33:30.650 That sucks. 00:33:30.650 --> 00:33:31.650 So. 00:33:31.650 --> 00:33:32.650 Let me do my job. 00:33:32.650 --> 00:33:33.650 That's just the way it's going to have to be, though. 00:33:33.650 --> 00:33:34.790 I think I just don't see a way out for us. 00:33:34.790 --> 00:33:36.970 We can't in good conscience continue to work with them. 00:33:36.970 --> 00:33:38.410 We have to have standards. 00:33:38.410 --> 00:33:43.330 The way out of this topic, though, is transitioning into NVIDIA ending game stream and recommending 00:33:43.330 --> 00:33:48.330 Steam Link, which was really weird and surprising to me. 00:33:48.330 --> 00:33:49.330 Yeah. 00:33:49.330 --> 00:33:50.650 NVIDIA has announced that it will be ending its Shield TV game stream feature in four days. 00:33:50.650 --> 00:33:51.650 Yeah. 00:33:51.650 --> 00:33:52.650 Yeah. 00:33:52.650 --> 00:33:54.330 It's going to be in February 2023. 00:33:54.330 --> 00:33:59.110 In response, users have expressed frustration and disappointment, with some arguing that 00:33:59.110 --> 00:34:05.390 the Steam Link app recommended by NVIDIA as an alternative is just not as good. 00:34:05.390 --> 00:34:09.630 For example, some users have reported that Steam Link has lower quality video, less responsive 00:34:09.630 --> 00:34:12.830 controls or slower speeds compared to game stream. 00:34:12.830 --> 00:34:16.450 Others have complained that the apps interface or the need to purchase a separate device 00:34:16.450 --> 00:34:17.450 to use it. 00:34:17.450 --> 00:34:18.450 Now, separate device. 00:34:18.450 --> 00:34:22.150 I mean, you already needed an NVIDIA Android device to use game stream. 00:34:22.650 --> 00:34:25.970 I don't know if I really buy that one, because you can install Steam Link on a shield. 00:34:25.970 --> 00:34:28.410 To be fair, I think it's a separate device compared to what. 00:34:28.410 --> 00:34:29.410 Oh, I see. 00:34:29.410 --> 00:34:30.410 Yeah. 00:34:30.410 --> 00:34:31.410 Yeah. 00:34:31.410 --> 00:34:33.050 So I don't agree with that. 00:34:33.050 --> 00:34:41.940 However, I do think that NVIDIA's investment into game stream was a real one and a good 00:34:41.940 --> 00:34:42.940 one. 00:34:42.940 --> 00:34:43.940 It was a good product. 00:34:43.940 --> 00:34:48.100 It was one that I personally was very enthusiastic about. 00:34:48.100 --> 00:34:51.100 And I've used Steam Link and they're right. 00:34:51.100 --> 00:34:52.100 It's not as good. 00:34:52.100 --> 00:34:53.320 It just. 00:34:53.320 --> 00:34:54.320 I don't know. 00:34:54.320 --> 00:34:55.320 I want Steam Link to be great. 00:34:55.320 --> 00:34:56.320 Yeah. 00:34:56.320 --> 00:34:57.320 But it's just not there. 00:34:57.320 --> 00:35:00.870 There are alternative options like Moonlight. 00:35:00.870 --> 00:35:01.870 That's dependent on game stream. 00:35:01.870 --> 00:35:02.870 Oh, is it really? 00:35:02.870 --> 00:35:04.670 I thought it just used the encoder. 00:35:04.670 --> 00:35:07.970 I didn't think it actually piggybacked on game stream. 00:35:07.970 --> 00:35:13.070 I'm not 100% certain in my completely independent of writing this article research. 00:35:13.070 --> 00:35:15.150 I heard that it's dependent on game stream. 00:35:15.150 --> 00:35:19.750 Oh, that sucks right now due to the power issues we're having. 00:35:19.750 --> 00:35:21.370 We don't actually have chat. 00:35:21.370 --> 00:35:23.530 These local laptops do not have Internet at all. 00:35:23.530 --> 00:35:24.530 Yeah. 00:35:24.530 --> 00:35:25.530 So we're we're working on that. 00:35:25.530 --> 00:35:27.530 But for now, we got nothing. 00:35:27.530 --> 00:35:30.730 So I can't I can't look into any of this and I can't see what you guys are saying. 00:35:30.730 --> 00:35:35.450 But some have suggested using Sunshine, which is a game stream host for Moonlight as an 00:35:35.450 --> 00:35:36.800 alternative. 00:35:36.800 --> 00:35:37.800 Do you have a SIM tool? 00:35:37.800 --> 00:35:38.800 Do I have a SIM tool? 00:35:38.800 --> 00:35:41.080 I do. 00:35:41.080 --> 00:35:42.500 I know. 00:35:42.500 --> 00:35:45.100 We should have at least three hours. 00:35:45.100 --> 00:35:46.100 Three hours. 00:35:46.100 --> 00:35:47.100 We got Jackery. 00:35:47.100 --> 00:35:48.100 Let's go. 00:35:48.100 --> 00:35:50.060 There's a Jackery plugged into the UPS. 00:35:50.060 --> 00:35:52.580 There's a Jackery plugged into the UPS. 00:35:52.580 --> 00:35:53.990 Jackery has a plug. 00:35:53.990 --> 00:35:54.990 Because it has a 20 amp plug. 00:35:54.990 --> 00:35:55.990 Of course it does. 00:35:55.990 --> 00:35:56.990 Yeah. 00:35:56.990 --> 00:35:57.990 Shout out. 00:35:57.990 --> 00:35:58.990 Shout. 00:35:58.990 --> 00:35:59.990 They didn't sponsor the WAN Show today, but they might as well have. 00:35:59.990 --> 00:36:05.010 Shout out Jackery for like sending us a new Jackery every time we do any kind of work 00:36:05.010 --> 00:36:06.010 with them. 00:36:06.010 --> 00:36:11.790 So we just have this pile of Jackery's that we keep charged in the event of an emergency. 00:36:11.790 --> 00:36:12.790 With good reason. 00:36:12.790 --> 00:36:14.070 And are now using, which is amazing. 00:36:14.070 --> 00:36:15.070 Oh, you can use your phone. 00:36:15.070 --> 00:36:16.070 Yeah. 00:36:16.070 --> 00:36:17.070 My phone has Internet. 00:36:17.070 --> 00:36:18.070 So perfect. 00:36:18.070 --> 00:36:19.990 I'm keeping it away from the cables because there's crazy feedback that comes through. 00:36:19.990 --> 00:36:20.990 But whatever. 00:36:20.990 --> 00:36:21.990 Cool. 00:36:21.990 --> 00:36:23.990 Because Moonlight uses NVIDIA Game Streams. 00:36:23.990 --> 00:36:24.990 NVIDIA's Game Stream protocol. 00:36:24.990 --> 00:36:29.930 It is unclear if it will still work after the mid-February update. 00:36:29.930 --> 00:36:30.930 So it might work. 00:36:30.930 --> 00:36:31.930 Might. 00:36:31.930 --> 00:36:33.010 But maybe not forever. 00:36:33.010 --> 00:36:35.010 Or it might just not. 00:36:35.010 --> 00:36:36.010 Got it. 00:36:36.010 --> 00:36:37.010 We have no idea. 00:36:37.010 --> 00:36:38.010 A petition. 00:36:38.010 --> 00:36:39.010 This isn't going to work. 00:36:39.010 --> 00:36:43.130 A petition on Change.org has been created to try to reverse the decision to shut down 00:36:43.130 --> 00:36:45.270 Game Stream. 00:36:45.270 --> 00:36:48.950 The petition itself isn't going to work at all. 00:36:48.950 --> 00:36:54.250 Maybe pressure in general towards NVIDIA will do something, but no one has cared about petitions 00:36:54.250 --> 00:36:54.990 since like. 00:36:54.990 --> 00:36:55.990 The internet started. 00:36:55.990 --> 00:36:56.990 Yeah. 00:36:56.990 --> 00:36:57.990 So it's just a thing. 00:36:57.990 --> 00:36:58.990 Yeah. 00:36:58.990 --> 00:36:59.990 Which is unfortunate to be clear. 00:36:59.990 --> 00:37:00.990 We're not saying it should be that way. 00:37:00.990 --> 00:37:01.990 No. 00:37:01.990 --> 00:37:02.990 It just hasn't seemed to have any kind of effect. 00:37:02.990 --> 00:37:03.990 If you really want to get a company's attention, I would say that a hundred tweets to their 00:37:03.990 --> 00:37:04.990 corporate handle is going to be a hundred times more effective than 10,000 signatures 00:37:04.990 --> 00:37:05.990 on a Change.org petition. 00:37:05.990 --> 00:37:06.930 Especially if you get a bunch of people to do it at a very similar time. 00:37:06.930 --> 00:37:07.930 Yeah. 00:37:07.930 --> 00:37:08.930 So you can get it to translate. 00:37:08.930 --> 00:37:09.930 Yeah. 00:37:09.930 --> 00:37:10.930 Yeah. 00:37:10.930 --> 00:37:11.930 Yeah. 00:37:11.930 --> 00:37:12.930 Yeah. 00:37:12.930 --> 00:37:13.930 Yeah. 00:37:13.930 --> 00:37:14.930 Yeah. 00:37:14.930 --> 00:37:15.930 Yeah. 00:37:15.930 --> 00:37:16.930 Yeah. 00:37:16.930 --> 00:37:17.930 Yeah. 00:37:17.930 --> 00:37:18.930 Yeah. 00:37:18.930 --> 00:37:19.930 Yeah. 00:37:19.930 --> 00:37:20.930 Yeah. 00:37:20.930 --> 00:37:21.930 Yeah. 00:37:21.930 --> 00:37:22.930 Yeah. 00:37:22.930 --> 00:37:23.930 Yeah. 00:37:23.930 --> 00:37:24.930 Yeah. 00:37:24.930 --> 00:37:25.930 Yeah. 00:37:25.930 --> 00:37:26.930 Yeah. 00:37:26.930 --> 00:37:27.930 Yeah. 00:37:27.930 --> 00:37:28.930 Yeah. 00:37:28.930 --> 00:37:29.930 Yeah. 00:37:29.930 --> 00:37:30.930 Yeah. 00:37:30.930 --> 00:37:31.930 Yeah. 00:37:31.930 --> 00:37:32.930 Yeah. 00:37:32.930 --> 00:37:33.930 Yeah. 00:37:33.930 --> 00:37:34.930 Yeah. 00:37:34.930 --> 00:37:35.930 Yeah. 00:37:35.930 --> 00:37:36.930 Yeah. 00:37:36.930 --> 00:37:37.930 Yeah. 00:37:37.930 --> 00:37:38.930 Yeah. 00:37:38.930 --> 00:37:39.930 Yeah. 00:37:39.930 --> 00:37:40.930 Yeah. 00:37:40.930 --> 00:37:41.930 Yeah. 00:37:41.930 --> 00:37:42.930 Yeah. 00:37:42.930 --> 00:37:43.930 Yeah. 00:37:43.930 --> 00:37:44.930 Yeah. 00:37:44.930 --> 00:37:45.930 Yeah. 00:37:45.930 --> 00:37:46.930 Yeah. 00:37:46.930 --> 00:37:47.930 Yeah. 00:37:47.930 --> 00:37:48.930 Yeah. 00:37:48.930 --> 00:37:49.930 Yeah. 00:37:49.930 --> 00:37:50.930 Yeah. 00:37:50.930 --> 00:37:51.930 Yeah. 00:37:51.930 --> 00:37:52.930 Yeah. 00:37:52.930 --> 00:37:53.930 Yeah. 00:37:53.930 --> 00:37:54.930 Yeah. 00:37:54.930 --> 00:37:58.170 The person at that level is just going to go, look, it's already over. 00:37:58.350 --> 00:37:58.590 Yes. 00:37:58.730 --> 00:37:59.250 It's fine. 00:37:59.330 --> 00:38:00.710 This is clearly resolved. 00:38:00.870 --> 00:38:01.030 Yeah. 00:38:01.150 --> 00:38:03.950 So if you are upset, you have to make noise. 00:38:04.230 --> 00:38:06.310 You have to continue to make noise. 00:38:06.490 --> 00:38:08.470 And then you have to not stop making noise. 00:38:08.470 --> 00:38:10.910 And you have to hope a lot of other people are doing the same thing. 00:38:10.990 --> 00:38:11.130 Yeah. 00:38:11.130 --> 00:38:12.930 If you're by yourself, it's not going to accomplish much. 00:38:13.030 --> 00:38:17.980 I mean, man, I see this in a number of different ways. 00:38:18.440 --> 00:38:21.000 I haven't touched GameStream in a long time. 00:38:21.120 --> 00:38:21.840 I was just going to say. 00:38:21.920 --> 00:38:24.800 I have three shields in my house and I haven't touched it. 00:38:24.800 --> 00:38:29.660 As much as this sucks, it might ultimately be what NVIDIA needs to do. 00:38:29.760 --> 00:38:32.400 As much as we just told everyone how to complain about this properly. 00:38:32.820 --> 00:38:38.740 If not enough people are using it, and if it's not really a driver for people to purchase 00:38:38.740 --> 00:38:42.380 their products, et cetera, and it's this huge cost sink, like companies are companies. 00:38:43.180 --> 00:38:43.320 Yeah. 00:38:43.460 --> 00:38:45.240 And NVIDIA is definitely a company. 00:38:45.420 --> 00:38:46.200 Oh, heck yeah. 00:38:46.660 --> 00:38:50.640 So like if it's, there are some cost sinks that companies will keep around. 00:38:50.820 --> 00:38:52.120 Cough, cough, the forum. 00:38:54.800 --> 00:38:55.580 Yeah, it doesn't cost that much. 00:38:55.620 --> 00:38:56.220 Not really. 00:38:56.360 --> 00:39:00.500 It's not a huge cost sink, but it definitely loses money. 00:39:02.200 --> 00:39:02.600 Yeah. 00:39:03.260 --> 00:39:04.360 Not a ton, but it's negative. 00:39:05.340 --> 00:39:07.720 But like you can't do that with everything. 00:39:08.100 --> 00:39:13.400 GameStream is probably a relatively complicated thing to keep updated and working with everything 00:39:13.400 --> 00:39:15.020 all the time and performant and whatnot. 00:39:15.140 --> 00:39:19.440 So like, I'm not happy this is going away. 00:39:20.060 --> 00:39:24.860 And I'm sure that the people who like started the change.org petition and the people that are, 00:39:24.860 --> 00:39:29.900 are really angry about this are people who have heavily integrated this into their setups. 00:39:30.500 --> 00:39:32.180 And that sucks. 00:39:32.240 --> 00:39:32.520 Yep. 00:39:32.820 --> 00:39:33.740 That's the thing. 00:39:33.920 --> 00:39:36.020 That's what Apple is so good at. 00:39:36.560 --> 00:39:43.160 They don't always have the best product, but dammit, that sucky product in their walled garden with 00:39:43.160 --> 00:39:47.100 their stupid limitations is going to still exist in five years. 00:39:47.180 --> 00:39:47.420 Yep. 00:39:48.080 --> 00:39:48.800 Not always. 00:39:48.860 --> 00:39:51.680 I mean, their, uh, their servers went away. 00:39:52.040 --> 00:39:54.380 Uh, what else could I point at as I've been there? 00:39:54.840 --> 00:40:02.660 Their professional desktops effectively went away, then came back for one generation and seem to have gone away again. 00:40:03.320 --> 00:40:08.700 They're not perfect, but if you buy an iPhone, you can expect continuity. 00:40:08.960 --> 00:40:13.700 You can expect that software for iPhone will still be an option on newer hardware. 00:40:13.700 --> 00:40:21.140 That I mean, 3d touch, uh, you know, by and large works the same way that the old one did, but more better. 00:40:21.500 --> 00:40:24.140 Like that's some, that is something that just plain. 00:40:24.140 --> 00:40:32.180 Sucks on the, the, the, the, the PC Android, more wild west open side of things like I, okay. 00:40:32.240 --> 00:40:36.440 We did a video right before the WAN Show on this wireless GPU. 00:40:37.190 --> 00:40:37.410 Okay. 00:40:37.410 --> 00:40:41.850 There was a, a four 60 that had five antennas hanging off of it. 00:40:41.850 --> 00:40:43.170 GTX four 60. 00:40:43.610 --> 00:40:47.610 I'll got all these antennas hanging off of it has this receiver dongle that comes with it. 00:40:47.610 --> 00:40:50.870 That has an HDMI out that goes into any HD display. 00:40:51.290 --> 00:40:53.750 And it was meant to be an all in one solution. 00:40:53.750 --> 00:40:54.990 For wireless display. 00:40:55.310 --> 00:40:55.670 Okay. 00:40:56.090 --> 00:40:57.170 Super cool product. 00:40:57.570 --> 00:41:10.730 But if you buy into that, literally design your home theater set up around it thinking I'm definitely going to have an upgrade path for this over the next few years, I'm going to integrate this into my life. 00:41:11.250 --> 00:41:11.930 You're an idiot. 00:41:12.350 --> 00:41:14.390 Cause it's not going to happen to be fair. 00:41:14.390 --> 00:41:15.210 It's NVIDIA. 00:41:15.890 --> 00:41:18.250 I don't think in videos killed a lot of their projects. 00:41:18.690 --> 00:41:19.430 I can't think of it. 00:41:20.250 --> 00:41:20.590 Sorry. 00:41:20.690 --> 00:41:22.990 Um, yeah, but the whole world. 00:41:22.990 --> 00:41:23.190 Okay. 00:41:23.190 --> 00:41:23.530 Thanks. 00:41:25.020 --> 00:41:26.720 Physics was around for a long time. 00:41:26.760 --> 00:41:27.140 Yeah. 00:41:27.140 --> 00:41:37.640 And it's technically still around, but not in the form that was promised to us in the days and in the wake of the NVIDIA acquisition, NVIDIA abandoned wears things. 00:41:38.180 --> 00:41:38.960 They do. 00:41:39.420 --> 00:41:40.020 They do. 00:41:40.080 --> 00:41:44.360 I guess, I guess my brain just keeps comparing it to Google and it's like, no, not really. 00:41:44.360 --> 00:41:46.160 But yeah, those are, those are a few examples. 00:41:46.160 --> 00:41:46.460 Yeah. 00:41:46.520 --> 00:41:47.700 The shield portable. 00:41:47.760 --> 00:41:48.200 Okay. 00:41:48.440 --> 00:41:50.780 Handheld handheld gaming consoles. 00:41:50.780 --> 00:41:51.660 What happened to those? 00:41:52.040 --> 00:41:53.280 One and done boom. 00:41:53.280 --> 00:41:53.900 See you later. 00:41:53.900 --> 00:41:55.160 Now, I'm video kills stuff. 00:41:55.160 --> 00:41:56.460 Let's not kid ourselves. 00:41:56.460 --> 00:41:57.500 Fair enough, fair enough. 00:41:57.680 --> 00:42:01.080 Um, and so, and so that really sucks. 00:42:01.340 --> 00:42:07.760 And that's one of the reasons that smart home has smart home technology has been such a struggle, right? 00:42:07.760 --> 00:42:12.260 Because there's no ecosystem that you can buy into and just hope for continuity. 00:42:12.260 --> 00:42:15.260 Well, you can buy into it and hope, but you're, but it's not going to come true. 00:42:15.440 --> 00:42:23.660 And so our discussion question here is to what extent does the removal of something like game stream represent a broken promise to customers of the NVIDIA? 00:42:23.660 --> 00:42:28.940 We can use way back machine at this point to go look at the marketing of the shield. 00:42:29.240 --> 00:42:44.280 Look at how prominently NVIDIA featured this particular, uh, capability of the product in their marketing and say, Hey, this is tantamount to outright false advertising at this point. 00:42:44.720 --> 00:42:53.420 And this is something that is happening more and more like a perfect example is what Google's done with their home, with their hub products and their, their nest home product. 00:42:53.420 --> 00:42:53.640 Yeah. 00:42:54.260 --> 00:43:02.920 Where that lawsuit from Sonos affected their ability to set up the product to such an extent that it is extremely user unfriendly. 00:43:02.920 --> 00:43:19.160 Now, I mean, you, you, I'm sorry, but there has to be legislation put in place that says if you advertise a fucking feature, you don't get to take it away with an update. 00:43:19.540 --> 00:43:22.780 You can't update your product to make it worse. 00:43:23.380 --> 00:43:24.280 My, my steam deck. 00:43:24.280 --> 00:43:24.440 Doesn't work. 00:43:24.460 --> 00:43:28.240 So I can't swear, but it's like, uh, it's the power zone is fine. 00:43:28.380 --> 00:43:31.540 Uh, it's, it's, it's, it's like the games recently as well. 00:43:31.540 --> 00:43:31.720 Right. 00:43:31.740 --> 00:43:34.220 We talked about these games, especially VR games. 00:43:34.560 --> 00:43:37.540 Uh, there was a few of them that didn't sell super well. 00:43:38.170 --> 00:43:43.970 So they just completely offlined all their servers, but they're online only games and people bought them. 00:43:44.090 --> 00:43:46.490 I don't even care if one person bought it. 00:43:46.590 --> 00:43:46.750 Yeah. 00:43:46.810 --> 00:43:48.110 You advertise this game. 00:43:48.150 --> 00:43:50.790 You shouldn't be able to shut down the servers like one year later. 00:43:50.870 --> 00:43:51.730 That's crazy. 00:43:52.050 --> 00:43:52.270 Yeah. 00:43:52.370 --> 00:43:53.150 That's ridiculous. 00:43:53.150 --> 00:43:54.190 Or you should have to. 00:43:54.190 --> 00:43:57.870 As we've said so many times, you should have to release the server side code. 00:43:57.950 --> 00:43:58.210 Yeah. 00:43:58.610 --> 00:43:59.290 At the very least. 00:43:59.290 --> 00:44:00.590 And if nobody picks it up. 00:44:01.120 --> 00:44:01.720 All right. 00:44:01.720 --> 00:44:02.320 So be it. 00:44:02.520 --> 00:44:02.620 Yeah. 00:44:02.700 --> 00:44:03.220 So be it. 00:44:03.400 --> 00:44:08.140 But if you advertise the feature, then I think there needs to be legislation in place. 00:44:08.140 --> 00:44:09.200 Your button's not working. 00:44:09.260 --> 00:44:10.220 I found out. 00:44:10.600 --> 00:44:15.220 Um, that in good faith, you have to provide the community. 00:44:15.990 --> 00:44:20.610 You have to give stewardship over to someone so that it can be maintained. 00:44:20.790 --> 00:44:20.950 Yeah. 00:44:21.490 --> 00:44:24.310 And I think when it comes to software, there's. 00:44:24.310 --> 00:44:29.830 Uh, vibrant enough open source community that someone would take this and run with it. 00:44:30.880 --> 00:44:43.840 I don't know if they're going to run with it as well as, uh, the, the SUPCOM guys, but yeah, there, there is still, uh, there are communities outside of the, uh, just honestly, fairly stunningly awesome Supreme commander community. 00:44:43.840 --> 00:44:49.480 There are communities outside of that, that are running old games that have become, uh, open source or shareware in some way. 00:44:49.720 --> 00:44:51.040 And it's, it's pretty cool. 00:44:52.180 --> 00:44:53.480 Um, we have one more. 00:44:53.660 --> 00:44:54.400 Whoa. 00:44:55.320 --> 00:44:56.300 Is that intentional? 00:44:56.360 --> 00:44:59.480 Oh, I think they're using Jackery's to restore it. 00:44:59.480 --> 00:45:00.140 Wait, no, it is. 00:45:00.140 --> 00:45:01.760 This is the power is the power on. 00:45:02.740 --> 00:45:04.020 No emergency lights. 00:45:04.040 --> 00:45:08.200 I think that, yeah, they're using Jackery's to, uh, to bring the lights back on. 00:45:08.700 --> 00:45:09.720 Oh, it is back on. 00:45:11.280 --> 00:45:12.660 The emergency lights are off, right? 00:45:12.660 --> 00:45:13.020 That should. 00:45:14.200 --> 00:45:14.760 Okay. 00:45:14.980 --> 00:45:15.420 All right. 00:45:18.310 --> 00:45:18.670 All right. 00:45:18.670 --> 00:45:19.330 We've got this. 00:45:19.330 --> 00:45:20.350 Can we turn this back on? 00:45:20.350 --> 00:45:20.930 Yeah, it might be. 00:45:20.930 --> 00:45:21.850 Uh, Hey. 00:45:22.390 --> 00:45:22.750 All right. 00:45:22.750 --> 00:45:22.950 Cool. 00:45:22.950 --> 00:45:23.650 That right there. 00:45:25.160 --> 00:45:28.580 Um, is someone from float. 00:45:28.600 --> 00:45:32.620 Plane trying to figure out getting access to these files to kind of stitch everything on it. 00:45:32.680 --> 00:45:32.980 Yeah. 00:45:33.360 --> 00:45:37.300 AJ, you are an absolute French Canadian champion. 00:45:38.080 --> 00:45:39.100 Um, I'm sorry. 00:45:39.100 --> 00:45:39.940 I had to qualify. 00:45:39.940 --> 00:45:40.540 I'm, I'm fair. 00:45:40.540 --> 00:45:41.500 I'm fairly certain. 00:45:41.500 --> 00:45:43.780 He's got the first one coming down already. 00:45:43.840 --> 00:45:44.140 All right. 00:45:44.200 --> 00:45:45.760 Um, I don't know. 00:45:46.060 --> 00:45:49.280 I don't think he's even heard at this point that we need the second one. 00:45:49.420 --> 00:45:51.760 If you're watching this, AJ, I'm sorry, but it's true. 00:45:52.100 --> 00:45:52.360 All right. 00:45:52.360 --> 00:45:56.560 We're going to do our third, maybe written by AI topic. 00:45:57.060 --> 00:45:58.380 Facial recognition. 00:45:58.380 --> 00:46:03.660 Was used to bar a lawyer pun intended from entering a venue. 00:46:03.660 --> 00:46:07.740 And this maybe doesn't sound like that big of a deal, but it's a big deal. 00:46:08.400 --> 00:46:22.940 A mother accompanying her daughter's girl scout troop to a Rockettes show at radio city music hall in Manhattan over the Thanksgiving weekend was denied entry after facial recognition software, allegedly identified her. 00:46:22.940 --> 00:46:28.260 So this is before submitting any kind of identification or ticket or anything. 00:46:28.380 --> 00:46:45.860 Kelly Conlin, imagine doing this to a lawyer on purpose, anyway, Kelly Conlin, the woman in question works as a lawyer for a firm that is involved in a personal injury claim against, um, MSG entertainment, the group that owns the venue. 00:46:46.280 --> 00:46:51.740 She does not, however, practice in New York and is not involved in the particular case. 00:46:52.400 --> 00:46:58.280 So Conlin claims she was approached by security and asked to produce identification. 00:46:58.700 --> 00:47:10.640 After passing through the metal detectors into the main lobby, a sign in the lobby does state that facial recognition technology is in use for the safety of guests and employees. 00:47:12.350 --> 00:47:13.130 Interesting. 00:47:14.010 --> 00:47:26.290 MSG entertainment claims they have a policy that precludes attorneys pursuing active litigation against the company from attending events at our venues until that litigation has been resolved. 00:47:29.650 --> 00:47:31.690 Brutal, absolutely. 00:47:31.690 --> 00:47:31.910 Brutal. 00:47:32.350 --> 00:47:35.710 The heck timeline are we on Luke? 00:47:36.010 --> 00:47:40.210 Imagine going into, uh, I don't even know if these exist. 00:47:40.390 --> 00:47:43.750 Imagine going into an anchor one random person. 00:47:43.930 --> 00:47:57.250 Who's never even heard of this story that works at, uh, one of the companies here walking into an anchor store and being told to leave because they know that they're employed by the parent company of this company that has some kind of ongoing dispute. 00:47:57.370 --> 00:47:57.670 Yeah. 00:47:58.090 --> 00:48:01.470 Like this can, it doesn't even have to be a dispute, right? 00:48:01.510 --> 00:48:01.750 This. 00:48:01.750 --> 00:48:05.130 This can of worms is open wild. 00:48:05.350 --> 00:48:23.210 Imagine any, uh, Sonos employee was to try to use a Google service if they bought a Google home and went to set it up and it used AI voice recognition to say, Hey, we couldn't help noticing that you're such and such from Google's hardware division. 00:48:23.510 --> 00:48:25.270 Uh, why don't you go F yourself? 00:48:25.330 --> 00:48:28.770 And, uh, yeah, that's pretty much it. 00:48:28.770 --> 00:48:29.310 See you later. 00:48:31.150 --> 00:48:32.670 Absolutely. 00:48:32.670 --> 00:48:33.110 What? 00:48:33.110 --> 00:48:33.890 Wild. 00:48:36.670 --> 00:48:37.430 Yeah, that's crazy. 00:48:38.850 --> 00:48:39.870 Absolutely crazy. 00:48:39.930 --> 00:48:40.710 Discussion question. 00:48:40.710 --> 00:48:48.030 What are your feelings about facial recognition being used to bar people from events based on, uh, scraped data sets like this? 00:48:48.810 --> 00:48:50.730 Um, when is it appropriate? 00:48:50.730 --> 00:48:51.430 When is it not? 00:48:51.430 --> 00:48:52.290 Where's the line? 00:48:54.130 --> 00:48:55.910 This is bad. 00:48:57.220 --> 00:48:58.100 Uh, I don't know. 00:48:58.100 --> 00:48:59.360 I'm, I'm hot spotted. 00:49:00.980 --> 00:49:02.320 Uh, I, I can check though. 00:49:02.320 --> 00:49:02.860 I'll check. 00:49:03.100 --> 00:49:03.400 Jinx. 00:49:03.400 --> 00:49:04.120 You owe me a ride home. 00:49:04.940 --> 00:49:06.920 I, I, I mean, that was the plan. 00:49:06.920 --> 00:49:07.120 Okay. 00:49:07.120 --> 00:49:07.240 Okay. 00:49:07.240 --> 00:49:07.540 Okay. 00:49:07.540 --> 00:49:07.600 Okay. 00:49:07.600 --> 00:49:07.720 Okay. 00:49:07.720 --> 00:49:07.960 Okay. 00:49:07.960 --> 00:49:11.760 Um, I'm taking him for a ride in my new car. 00:49:12.840 --> 00:49:13.220 Yeah. 00:49:14.350 --> 00:49:16.070 I haven't really talked about it yet. 00:49:16.070 --> 00:49:18.130 I think that's the first public announcement. 00:49:18.130 --> 00:49:20.250 That's the first public acknowledgement. 00:49:20.310 --> 00:49:27.850 I don't know about appropriate, but one thing I'm going to throw out there is I think this might become a big thing for political events. 00:49:28.430 --> 00:49:28.950 Yeah. 00:49:28.970 --> 00:49:29.730 Oh, wow. 00:49:29.730 --> 00:49:36.580 Cause if you can keep protesters out by knowing what their affiliations are based on facial recognition, pairing that, pairing that with public recognition. 00:49:36.580 --> 00:49:38.000 Where else they've been seen? 00:49:38.000 --> 00:49:38.580 Pairing that with public recognition. 00:49:38.580 --> 00:49:47.900 Public information, like Twitter accounts or whatever else, um, and figuring out if you want to let people in, uh, I, I think that's absolutely going to be a thing. 00:49:47.900 --> 00:49:53.100 I'm not going to take a stance on how I feel about the appropriateness of that. 00:49:53.280 --> 00:49:55.200 I just see that happening. 00:49:55.200 --> 00:50:08.160 I see this, I see this coming down to like a Supreme court tier, like, like free, like first amendment kind of thing in the U S and then I suspect, uh, Canada is going to pull their usual. 00:50:08.160 --> 00:50:09.760 That's the thing where we basically just. 00:50:10.900 --> 00:50:11.880 Copy what the U S does. 00:50:11.880 --> 00:50:13.140 Yeah, do whatever the U S does. 00:50:13.140 --> 00:50:13.460 Yeah. 00:50:13.680 --> 00:50:14.080 Uh, yeah. 00:50:14.080 --> 00:50:19.360 We're a super cool independent country and we advance, uh, directly in step with the U S. 00:50:19.360 --> 00:50:21.420 Sometimes we ignore what they do, which is good. 00:50:21.520 --> 00:50:24.360 Um, other times we ignore what they do and it's not as good. 00:50:24.400 --> 00:50:24.720 Yeah. 00:50:24.820 --> 00:50:28.800 Anywho, the point is that this is, I think this is headed for the Supreme court. 00:50:28.800 --> 00:50:38.340 Cause I think ultimately there there's going to be like, um, like a, like a personal rights argument from both sides on the one hand. 00:50:38.640 --> 00:50:44.880 Discriminating against someone based on their profession or their place of work seems like pretty open shut. 00:50:45.120 --> 00:51:00.220 But on the other hand, to tell a venue that they are, that they do not have the right to refuse service to an individual customer on their own bloody property is also seems pretty open and shut, right? 00:51:00.240 --> 00:51:00.860 It's weird. 00:51:00.880 --> 00:51:04.160 There's a strong argument, both ways, strong argument. 00:51:04.160 --> 00:51:08.560 There's a lot of technological stuff coming out right now that. 00:51:08.740 --> 00:51:15.920 The law is so far behind and it doesn't help that half of the legislators in the Western world are septuagenarians. 00:51:15.920 --> 00:51:19.900 As far as I can tell, no idea what's going on, no idea what's going on. 00:51:20.900 --> 00:51:27.400 And even the younger ones, quite frankly, could stand to be a little more tech savvy based on a lot of the C-SPAN that I've seen. 00:51:27.520 --> 00:51:28.020 Yep. 00:51:28.240 --> 00:51:28.740 Yep. 00:51:29.680 --> 00:51:30.160 Okay. 00:51:30.220 --> 00:51:32.880 So at least one. 00:51:32.880 --> 00:51:34.180 Jake has apparently joined the show. 00:51:34.180 --> 00:51:35.800 Oh no, he's not sitting in the producer cam. 00:51:35.800 --> 00:51:36.380 So we missed him. 00:51:36.380 --> 00:51:37.200 Lean to the right Jake. 00:51:39.350 --> 00:51:46.970 Apparently he's here in case the, uh, the power goes out again, things, things have gotten a little hairy this evening. 00:51:46.970 --> 00:51:47.850 It's been a fun night. 00:51:48.090 --> 00:51:51.570 Um, my roof caved in. 00:51:51.590 --> 00:51:52.590 That's a fun thing. 00:51:52.790 --> 00:52:04.070 Uh, minutes after leaving my, uh, my apartment to come to work, I got a call from my girlfriend saying that, uh, part of the ceiling had ripped through and it was raining in one of the bathrooms. 00:52:04.410 --> 00:52:06.870 Um, we thought it was a. 00:52:07.290 --> 00:52:09.410 Previous, uh, a leak that we had previously found. 00:52:09.410 --> 00:52:11.030 The house that was caused by the AC. 00:52:11.210 --> 00:52:18.190 It wasn't that it was the roof of the apartment building was leaking into the attic and then ripped through our ceiling. 00:52:18.410 --> 00:52:19.430 So that was cool. 00:52:19.490 --> 00:52:20.330 I haven't been to go. 00:52:20.370 --> 00:52:22.430 I haven't been able to go help with that, but she's been doing a great job. 00:52:22.430 --> 00:52:31.370 Luke had to co-host a video with me before the show today, uh, reacting to our worst videos and he should it. 00:52:32.410 --> 00:52:32.710 Okay. 00:52:33.370 --> 00:52:35.710 For real talking, talking from the heart here. 00:52:35.710 --> 00:52:36.070 Okay. 00:52:36.410 --> 00:52:38.330 I have to commend your professionalism. 00:52:38.610 --> 00:52:38.890 Oh. 00:52:39.410 --> 00:52:48.940 He showed up looking like an actual storm cloud, like jaw set, teeth clenched, pissed. 00:52:49.720 --> 00:52:53.940 We turned on the camera and he's like, this video is terrible. 00:52:56.230 --> 00:52:57.070 Classic Luke. 00:52:57.790 --> 00:52:59.770 It helps that they were actually pretty terrible. 00:53:01.690 --> 00:53:04.030 We've made some stickers over the years. 00:53:05.770 --> 00:53:09.530 There's one, there's one that I had completely forgotten about. 00:53:09.530 --> 00:53:09.670 Actually. 00:53:09.670 --> 00:53:11.290 I have no memory of it at all. 00:53:11.290 --> 00:53:18.790 Hosted by Luke hosted, like clearly it's, it's something that I did and it's, it's really bad. 00:53:19.050 --> 00:53:20.170 I, wow. 00:53:20.190 --> 00:53:20.650 Yeah. 00:53:20.770 --> 00:53:24.850 There's also a couple in there that I expected to see the, uh, the Blackberry one. 00:53:24.850 --> 00:53:29.950 I like I did the, the second I heard the premise of the video, I was like, Blackberry video, Blackberry video is going to be in there. 00:53:30.310 --> 00:53:31.430 Um, it's awful. 00:53:31.690 --> 00:53:32.110 Oh yeah. 00:53:32.110 --> 00:53:32.650 It's terrible. 00:53:32.710 --> 00:53:34.390 But yeah, that'll be a, that'll be a fun video. 00:53:34.430 --> 00:53:36.370 I have done some stuff, you know? 00:53:37.190 --> 00:53:39.790 I didn't feel like as a mid twenties. 00:53:39.790 --> 00:53:43.810 Something that my sense of humor was probably going to change. 00:53:44.800 --> 00:53:47.140 I felt like what I was doing and thought was funny. 00:53:47.140 --> 00:53:50.060 Then I would probably still think is funny in 10 years. 00:53:50.930 --> 00:53:51.770 It's not funny. 00:53:51.830 --> 00:53:52.610 We'd laughed at it. 00:53:52.610 --> 00:53:56.470 We did laugh, but we were laughing at me. 00:53:56.510 --> 00:53:59.630 That WD video was so funny. 00:54:00.010 --> 00:54:01.370 It was not funny. 00:54:01.370 --> 00:54:02.710 It was cringe. 00:54:02.810 --> 00:54:03.530 Yeah, I guess so. 00:54:03.530 --> 00:54:08.570 It was cringe so hard that it goes all the way around back to funny. 00:54:09.050 --> 00:54:09.790 There, there's a couple. 00:54:09.790 --> 00:54:10.870 Comments about my birds. 00:54:10.870 --> 00:54:11.650 The birds are fine. 00:54:12.010 --> 00:54:14.910 Um, my, my girlfriend got the birds back into cages. 00:54:15.070 --> 00:54:15.810 They're covered. 00:54:16.090 --> 00:54:16.710 Everything's fine. 00:54:16.990 --> 00:54:19.870 Um, we did not include the hide your porn one. 00:54:20.230 --> 00:54:21.850 I don't even think that video was that bad. 00:54:21.910 --> 00:54:22.570 I think that video did. 00:54:22.570 --> 00:54:22.870 Okay. 00:54:22.970 --> 00:54:24.150 It might be cringy. 00:54:24.150 --> 00:54:25.630 Like the humor is probably terrible. 00:54:25.690 --> 00:54:28.390 Oh, um, but I think that is anything we've ever done. 00:54:28.410 --> 00:54:30.850 I think like performance wise, I think it did fine. 00:54:31.210 --> 00:54:39.600 Um, I'll always remember the script review meeting for that because Luke wrote some cringy. 00:54:39.600 --> 00:54:39.960 Like I. 00:54:39.960 --> 00:54:47.820 It was his idea to have like, basically a lot of the shots be, you know, uh, suggestive. 00:54:47.820 --> 00:54:48.120 Right. 00:54:48.980 --> 00:54:51.660 And then I think that you thought, do you remember this? 00:54:52.340 --> 00:54:54.900 Uh, I, I, not with full clarity. 00:54:54.900 --> 00:54:58.560 I, yeah, I think that you thought I was going to come in and tone it down. 00:54:59.160 --> 00:55:04.740 And then I amped it up to the point where even you were kind of like, Oh, this is pretty bad. 00:55:06.180 --> 00:55:07.560 It honestly sounds about right. 00:55:07.600 --> 00:55:07.860 Yeah. 00:55:08.440 --> 00:55:08.740 Yeah. 00:55:09.180 --> 00:55:09.420 Yeah. 00:55:09.420 --> 00:55:10.540 Two, 2.2 million. 00:55:10.560 --> 00:55:10.720 Yeah. 00:55:10.720 --> 00:55:12.460 I'm going to come in and do like the review meeting. 00:55:12.460 --> 00:55:12.520 Yeah. 00:55:12.520 --> 00:55:12.840 I'm going to come in and do like the review meeting. 00:55:12.840 --> 00:55:13.340 I'm going to come in and do like the review meeting. 00:55:13.340 --> 00:55:13.380 Yeah. 00:55:13.380 --> 00:55:13.880 And then I'm going to be like, Oh, this is pretty good. 00:55:13.880 --> 00:55:14.380 And then I'm going to go in and do like the review meeting. 00:55:14.380 --> 00:55:14.440 And I'm going to be like, Oh, this is pretty good. 00:55:14.440 --> 00:55:14.460 Yeah. 00:55:14.460 --> 00:55:14.480 Um, it was pretty good from seven years ago. 00:55:14.480 --> 00:55:15.460 There's some real tech tips in there. 00:55:15.460 --> 00:55:22.460 I mean, I don't know how relevant most of them are now that incognito mode and like just everything being shockingly easily accessible as the thing. 00:55:22.580 --> 00:55:22.680 Yeah. 00:55:22.680 --> 00:55:26.900 I guess it would help it hide from you, like your parents to a certain degree, but incognito mode, isn't really enough. 00:55:26.900 --> 00:55:30.580 I'm pretty sure TrueCrypt was in there, which isn't really a thing anymore. 00:55:31.240 --> 00:55:33.680 So, like, it's definitely a little dated, but yeah. 00:55:33.680 --> 00:55:35.680 Something like it, probably useful still. 00:55:35.940 --> 00:55:37.020 Okay, back to it, though. 00:55:37.420 --> 00:55:40.180 We just did three core topics. 00:55:40.500 --> 00:55:42.480 Eufy, NVIDIA, facial recognition. 00:55:43.220 --> 00:55:44.020 Some amount. 00:55:44.320 --> 00:55:45.440 I haven't told them how many. 00:55:45.960 --> 00:55:46.960 It could be all of them. 00:55:47.360 --> 00:55:48.140 It could be one. 00:55:48.400 --> 00:55:48.940 It could be two. 00:55:49.380 --> 00:55:54.900 Some amount of them were written, massaged slightly so that it fits our format a little bit better. 00:55:54.900 --> 00:56:01.460 But written with some minor edits by ChatGPT. 00:56:02.540 --> 00:56:04.780 And now you need to try to identify which ones. 00:56:05.020 --> 00:56:11.700 I also, because I think this is important and interesting, want to know why you think this for each one. 00:56:13.040 --> 00:56:15.420 Man, the fact that... 00:56:15.420 --> 00:56:17.820 The fact that it's this tough is very interesting. 00:56:18.220 --> 00:56:21.540 Okay, but the fact that a human went through and massaged it... 00:56:21.540 --> 00:56:22.000 That is true. 00:56:22.760 --> 00:56:23.280 That is true. 00:56:23.700 --> 00:56:24.880 Makes it really tough. 00:56:24.880 --> 00:56:25.780 I don't know how much of that... 00:56:25.780 --> 00:56:27.320 I don't know how much of that was done because it wasn't me. 00:56:27.600 --> 00:56:28.680 James prepared this. 00:56:30.280 --> 00:56:35.040 I do know that he said, like, many of these are, like, full sentences. 00:56:35.280 --> 00:56:38.840 Like, he mostly shaped it instead of changed it, if that makes sense. 00:56:39.120 --> 00:56:40.280 That's my understanding. 00:56:40.860 --> 00:56:41.420 It's been a bit... 00:56:41.420 --> 00:56:44.300 A lot has happened since I talked to James. 00:56:44.300 --> 00:56:46.960 I think the Eufy one was written by ChatGPT. 00:56:47.280 --> 00:56:47.580 Okay. 00:56:57.810 --> 00:57:01.170 That's the only one that I think for sure was written by ChatGPT. 00:57:01.510 --> 00:57:03.030 So you get one point. 00:57:04.710 --> 00:57:05.530 You get... 00:57:05.530 --> 00:57:06.050 Okay, no. 00:57:06.270 --> 00:57:06.790 You get two points. 00:57:06.790 --> 00:57:07.630 Hold on, hold on, hold on. 00:57:09.060 --> 00:57:12.420 Okay, he hasn't explained the points, so I think I can still clarify further. 00:57:12.660 --> 00:57:12.820 Yeah. 00:57:13.080 --> 00:57:16.620 I think that the NVIDIA one was written by a human. 00:57:17.100 --> 00:57:17.540 Okay. 00:57:18.670 --> 00:57:21.590 I am not sure about the facial recognition one. 00:57:24.220 --> 00:57:25.800 I don't know how to give you points anymore. 00:57:26.480 --> 00:57:27.580 You got one right. 00:57:28.100 --> 00:57:28.400 Okay. 00:57:28.740 --> 00:57:29.680 You got one wrong. 00:57:30.570 --> 00:57:32.670 And you got one maybe, I guess. 00:57:32.790 --> 00:57:34.390 The answer to the facial recognition one... 00:57:34.390 --> 00:57:37.010 The facial recognition one was written by a human. 00:57:38.020 --> 00:57:38.480 Both of them... 00:57:38.480 --> 00:57:39.920 Both of the other two are ChatGPT. 00:57:40.340 --> 00:57:40.780 Shoot. 00:57:41.860 --> 00:57:42.300 Wow. 00:57:43.640 --> 00:57:44.080 Wow. 00:57:45.260 --> 00:57:45.700 Yeah. 00:57:46.440 --> 00:57:46.880 Yeah. 00:57:47.180 --> 00:57:47.620 Wow. 00:57:48.100 --> 00:57:48.540 Yeah. 00:57:50.420 --> 00:57:50.860 Wow. 00:57:51.080 --> 00:57:51.860 Pretty crazy, eh? 00:57:52.560 --> 00:57:53.000 Yeah. 00:57:53.900 --> 00:57:57.640 So we've talked about this privately, and I don't have this prepared. 00:57:58.760 --> 00:58:00.500 But someone made... 00:58:00.500 --> 00:58:01.520 I wish... 00:58:01.520 --> 00:58:02.740 I wonder if I can bring it up. 00:58:05.400 --> 00:58:05.840 Here. 00:58:06.000 --> 00:58:09.840 I mean, just so that you guys can see what the notes look like for these, because that 00:58:09.840 --> 00:58:10.720 might not be... 00:58:10.720 --> 00:58:17.340 That might not be something that will translate perfectly for you, here's the Yuffie topic, 00:58:17.340 --> 00:58:23.320 which the reason that I thought that it was ChatGPT was because it was far less editorialized 00:58:23.320 --> 00:58:26.400 than some of our writers tend to... 00:58:26.400 --> 00:58:31.040 There's also things like, in a blog post addressed to Yuffie security customers and partners, 00:58:31.040 --> 00:58:33.100 bubble anchor, all of it's properly capitalized. 00:58:33.100 --> 00:58:34.100 Yeah. 00:58:34.100 --> 00:58:37.580 There's a few things that can make it stand out slightly. 00:58:37.580 --> 00:58:38.960 This one, though? 00:58:38.960 --> 00:58:40.060 The fact that it... 00:58:40.060 --> 00:58:41.260 Yeah. 00:58:41.260 --> 00:58:45.640 The fact that it really talked about what's going on around this. 00:58:45.640 --> 00:58:47.760 So I will add some context. 00:58:47.760 --> 00:58:49.480 It wasn't done... 00:58:49.480 --> 00:58:51.720 And some people on the stream will know this, and I think you'll know this. 00:58:51.720 --> 00:58:55.920 It wasn't done by just saying like, hey, summarize this link, because it can't... 00:58:55.920 --> 00:58:56.920 No, you can't do that. 00:58:56.920 --> 00:58:57.920 It can't crawl the web. 00:58:57.920 --> 00:59:04.080 So information was given to it, talking points were given to it, and then it turned them 00:59:04.080 --> 00:59:05.080 into whatever. 00:59:05.080 --> 00:59:06.080 Still. 00:59:06.080 --> 00:59:07.080 So we gave it notes. 00:59:07.080 --> 00:59:08.080 Still. 00:59:08.080 --> 00:59:09.080 Yeah. 00:59:09.080 --> 00:59:13.480 And then James gave it, I think it was like five or six links. 00:59:13.480 --> 00:59:18.040 It gave it the links and a five word blurb for each link. 00:59:18.040 --> 00:59:21.620 That was the NVIDIA one, actually. 00:59:21.620 --> 00:59:22.780 I wonder if I have a screenshot. 00:59:22.780 --> 00:59:24.560 I don't know if I'd be able to find it. 00:59:24.560 --> 00:59:27.900 It's in my team, so I wouldn't be able to show it very effectively on stream. 00:59:27.900 --> 00:59:30.080 But just very little information. 00:59:30.080 --> 00:59:34.440 But from information that is naturally in the URL of something that isn't obfuscated, 00:59:34.440 --> 00:59:38.440 and the little tiny three to five word little snippet of each post. 00:59:38.440 --> 00:59:39.440 Yeah. 00:59:39.440 --> 00:59:40.940 So James wrote this NVIDIA article. 00:59:40.940 --> 00:59:41.940 Wow. 00:59:41.940 --> 00:59:42.940 Which is pretty good. 00:59:42.940 --> 00:59:43.940 Wow. 00:59:43.940 --> 00:59:46.720 It was 100% enough for us to go off of. 00:59:46.720 --> 00:59:49.520 Super, super interesting. 00:59:49.520 --> 00:59:57.730 I was talking to Linus the other day about, oh, this is not even the one that I found. 00:59:57.730 --> 00:59:59.530 I Googled it and I found a different one. 00:59:59.530 --> 01:00:02.170 So more than one person has done this, which is interesting. 01:00:02.170 --> 01:00:03.510 Should I go to your laptop? 01:00:03.510 --> 01:00:04.510 I guess. 01:00:04.510 --> 01:00:05.510 I think this is what... 01:00:05.510 --> 01:00:08.150 Yeah, you can go to it. 01:00:08.150 --> 01:00:09.530 So this is, I don't know, every.tv. 01:00:09.530 --> 01:00:10.530 Yeah. 01:00:10.650 --> 01:00:11.890 I've never heard of this before. 01:00:11.890 --> 01:00:16.170 I built an AI chatbot based on my favorite podcast. 01:00:16.170 --> 01:00:19.150 This is a different person though than the one that I linked to you. 01:00:19.150 --> 01:00:20.150 Yeah. 01:00:20.150 --> 01:00:22.410 And it's not the exact same thing, but it's extremely close. 01:00:22.410 --> 01:00:24.850 This one looks like a command line thing, whatever, I don't know. 01:00:24.850 --> 01:00:27.670 So the one that I had found, it's an actual website that you can go to. 01:00:27.670 --> 01:00:30.930 These are both based off of the Huberman Lab podcast. 01:00:30.930 --> 01:00:34.610 But people have taken, I'm assuming, I have not read this article. 01:00:34.610 --> 01:00:37.410 The other one, I know this is how this works, and I'm assuming this person did it in the 01:00:37.410 --> 01:00:38.510 same way. 01:00:38.510 --> 01:00:40.250 They use a different open AI product. 01:00:40.250 --> 01:00:40.930 Yeah. 01:00:40.930 --> 01:00:47.190 So they fed all of Dr. Huberman's podcasts through Whisper, which is another open AI 01:00:47.190 --> 01:00:50.810 product, which transcribes audio to text. 01:00:50.810 --> 01:00:57.170 And then they fed all of the text into GPT-3, and then they made it so that you can ask 01:00:57.170 --> 01:01:03.570 the chatbot effectively questions about what Dr. Huberman says in his podcasts. 01:01:03.570 --> 01:01:08.750 And it will go through all of the transcripts of all of these three hour long, super dense 01:01:08.750 --> 01:01:09.750 podcasts. 01:01:09.750 --> 01:01:11.330 And it will pull answers out for you. 01:01:11.330 --> 01:01:15.190 The other one will also cite its references. 01:01:15.190 --> 01:01:20.730 So it'll say like, I got this from this podcast at this minute, and you can click on it, it'll 01:01:20.730 --> 01:01:24.750 bring up the podcast at that timestamp so you can listen to the original audio just 01:01:24.750 --> 01:01:27.510 in case you don't trust the transcription. 01:01:27.510 --> 01:01:31.690 This is super interesting for like a bunch of reasons. 01:01:31.690 --> 01:01:34.430 This is terrifying for content creators. 01:01:34.430 --> 01:01:35.430 Podcast industry. 01:01:35.430 --> 01:01:36.430 Yeah. 01:01:36.430 --> 01:01:38.430 Especially if you are a very information dense podcast. 01:01:38.430 --> 01:01:39.430 Yeah. 01:01:39.750 --> 01:01:44.830 Like the Huberman Lab podcast, because now people don't have to listen to your content 01:01:44.830 --> 01:01:46.110 or consume it at all. 01:01:46.110 --> 01:01:51.710 These random people on the internet just made a way completely detached from your content 01:01:51.710 --> 01:01:54.990 that you have absolutely no way of being paid for. 01:01:54.990 --> 01:01:55.990 Nope. 01:01:55.990 --> 01:01:59.350 And they made a way for people to completely bypass all of your stuff. 01:01:59.350 --> 01:02:03.210 It's super helpful for users that want to pull information out of it. 01:02:03.210 --> 01:02:09.230 It's super not helpful for you being able to grow your, your, your, your channel or 01:02:09.230 --> 01:02:12.150 your audience or continue to do your podcast, continue to do it at all, really. 01:02:12.150 --> 01:02:18.070 So from a copyright standpoint though, man, see how do you control it? 01:02:18.070 --> 01:02:20.270 I mean, it's just like the artist thing, right? 01:02:20.270 --> 01:02:25.470 So there's nothing inherently wrong with AI generated or machine learning generated artwork. 01:02:25.470 --> 01:02:26.470 Yeah. 01:02:26.470 --> 01:02:31.590 The issue is how it was trained and proper compensation for the dataset that it was trained 01:02:31.590 --> 01:02:32.590 on. 01:02:32.590 --> 01:02:35.430 And Luke talked about this extensively enough in last week and the week before that I don't 01:02:35.430 --> 01:02:37.230 think we need to tread over it again this week. 01:02:37.230 --> 01:02:38.230 Yeah. 01:02:38.230 --> 01:02:39.230 Yeah. 01:02:39.230 --> 01:02:44.810 There's no problem with a bot that compiles answers to questions as long as it is properly 01:02:44.810 --> 01:02:49.490 compensating whoever's original work was used to train it. 01:02:49.490 --> 01:02:55.170 But as of this time, that's not being done and there is no framework whatsoever for that 01:02:55.170 --> 01:02:56.390 to be done. 01:02:56.390 --> 01:03:02.350 So for the same reason that artists are crying foul about their artwork being used to train 01:03:02.350 --> 01:03:09.230 their machine replacement, uh, I could see a podcaster crying foul about their bot. 01:03:09.230 --> 01:03:10.230 Yeah. 01:03:10.230 --> 01:03:12.310 They're just trying to make use of their body of work, their body of copyrighted work being 01:03:12.310 --> 01:03:16.870 used to create a tool that irrelevance their copyrighted work. 01:03:16.870 --> 01:03:20.550 And I don't think you're gonna be able to make a very solid, fair use argument for something 01:03:20.550 --> 01:03:27.760 like this because yes, for personal use, you could probably make the argument that there 01:03:27.760 --> 01:03:34.340 is nothing wrong with watching all of the episodes. 01:03:34.340 --> 01:03:40.120 Therefore having all of the words for yourself and making those where it's creating an index, 01:03:40.120 --> 01:03:47.800 of those words and a way to recall various words in some way, right? But as soon as you make it 01:03:47.800 --> 01:03:52.960 more broadly available, especially commercially available, that falls apart. To be fair, 01:03:53.040 --> 01:03:58.310 all the ones that I've seen so far have not been commercially driven. One interesting one, 01:03:58.350 --> 01:04:02.230 the first one that I found, and I don't know why I can't find it right now. I'm sure I could if I 01:04:02.230 --> 01:04:07.110 use my Google Foo a little bit more effectively. But the first one that I found, the whole thing 01:04:07.110 --> 01:04:11.470 is open source too. You put it all in GitHub. And the fact that multiple people have done this 01:04:11.470 --> 01:04:17.340 already, proof that it's not really that hard. The person that I had looked into originally said 01:04:17.340 --> 01:04:23.830 it took them less than a day. The process is all kind of already there. You're just sort of linking 01:04:23.830 --> 01:04:29.230 things together, right? We've got a couple interesting viewer comments here. So Eric 01:04:29.230 --> 01:04:35.130 RC on Floatplane says, Linus, I disagree. I don't believe most people listen to podcasts 01:04:35.130 --> 01:04:37.490 just for answers. There's a definite entertainment value. 01:04:37.830 --> 01:04:41.450 But this is just like what I was talking about earlier, where just because you don't need to 01:04:41.450 --> 01:04:49.390 put your laptop to sleep doesn't mean that I don't. So yeah, this podcast, I don't think anyone 01:04:49.390 --> 01:04:56.300 necessarily would. No one needs to search this for information. Or it's unlikely, but someone 01:04:56.300 --> 01:05:00.280 could. Yeah, because we're going to be a secondary source a lot of the time, unless you're looking 01:05:00.280 --> 01:05:05.500 for information about my life or Luke's life or whatever else the case may be. And if that's the 01:05:05.500 --> 01:05:07.700 case, probably it would be... 01:05:07.720 --> 01:05:12.040 It would be more interesting to hear it as told by us anyway. I think The WAN Show is a more 01:05:12.040 --> 01:05:18.240 entertainment show anyhow. And I'm not saying that because there's some kind of like liability, 01:05:18.540 --> 01:05:21.260 oh, advice on The WAN Show should be taken for entertainment purposes only. It's just, 01:05:21.520 --> 01:05:26.960 I do think that that's the show that we try to run for you guys. But that doesn't mean that 01:05:26.960 --> 01:05:31.460 every podcast is like that. Some of them are very Q&A driven, very information driven. 01:05:31.920 --> 01:05:34.580 And Hubermans are extremely information driven. There are also lots... 01:05:34.580 --> 01:05:35.460 And not that entertaining. 01:05:35.880 --> 01:05:37.080 There are also lots of... 01:05:37.080 --> 01:05:37.700 I don't know about that one. But... 01:05:37.720 --> 01:05:41.760 Sure. But there is a lot. You're right, though. There is a lot of educational or 01:05:41.760 --> 01:05:45.920 informational based podcasts. There's tons of science based podcasts. There's tons of 01:05:45.920 --> 01:05:47.800 even like... 01:05:47.800 --> 01:05:49.460 It's more about keeping up with the industry. 01:05:49.700 --> 01:05:49.920 Yes. 01:05:49.940 --> 01:05:51.240 And less about being entertained. 01:05:51.400 --> 01:05:51.700 Yes. 01:05:51.820 --> 01:05:51.980 Right? 01:05:52.160 --> 01:05:52.360 Yeah. 01:05:52.780 --> 01:05:53.760 And so... 01:05:53.760 --> 01:05:55.980 Or like, imagine there's a self-help podcast. 01:05:56.400 --> 01:05:56.680 Sure. 01:05:56.880 --> 01:06:02.180 You might look for answers to somewhat common self-help questions by using this thing. 01:06:02.180 --> 01:06:07.160 Whatever it is, there are lots of not just like storytelling entertainment style. 01:06:07.280 --> 01:06:07.540 Yes. 01:06:07.720 --> 01:06:07.940 Things. 01:06:08.280 --> 01:06:10.240 And so that's a big challenge. 01:06:11.160 --> 01:06:16.180 And an ethereal llama says, isn't this part of the territory when you post free content on the internet, though? 01:06:17.040 --> 01:06:17.480 No. 01:06:17.620 --> 01:06:17.800 No. 01:06:18.040 --> 01:06:19.320 The content isn't free. 01:06:19.900 --> 01:06:23.480 We've talked about this before and some people are never going to understand it. 01:06:23.580 --> 01:06:25.800 But that's really just not my problem at a certain point. 01:06:26.180 --> 01:06:27.580 The content isn't free. 01:06:28.240 --> 01:06:32.620 There is an implicit agreement that the content is going to be supported in some way. 01:06:32.620 --> 01:06:33.700 Otherwise, it won't exist. 01:06:33.900 --> 01:06:37.620 Otherwise, it would explicitly be said that it is free. 01:06:38.120 --> 01:06:40.120 Linus Tech Tips is not free. 01:06:40.620 --> 01:06:48.800 Linus Tech Tips is paid for by actual money, which we get from ads or from subscriptions. 01:06:49.000 --> 01:06:56.060 And it is possible that something is free, but that also does not mean that its license allows you to do this with it. 01:06:56.220 --> 01:06:56.600 Correct. 01:06:56.880 --> 01:07:01.220 There is a ton of different levels of variation when it comes to licensing. 01:07:01.460 --> 01:07:07.160 And you could absolutely release a podcast with a license where you allow people to do this. 01:07:07.160 --> 01:07:07.400 Right. 01:07:07.400 --> 01:07:08.200 Absolutely. 01:07:08.200 --> 01:07:09.920 There's nothing stopping you from doing that. 01:07:09.920 --> 01:07:14.240 You could say everything that I say into this podcast is free for everyone to use in any way. 01:07:14.240 --> 01:07:16.240 And no, I did not just say that about WAN Show. 01:07:16.240 --> 01:07:21.880 But you could say that, but I do not believe that has been said by these people. 01:07:21.880 --> 01:07:33.800 But what I was going to say is a dangerous intrusive thought that comes up when I've already heard about this thing where they're taking podcasts and they're transcribing them and stuff. 01:07:33.800 --> 01:07:35.100 And I'm not going to go into that. 01:07:35.100 --> 01:07:35.920 I'm not going to go into that. 01:07:35.920 --> 01:07:36.880 I'm not going to go into that. 01:07:36.880 --> 01:07:37.740 It's false. 01:07:37.740 --> 01:07:40.420 I mean, they can't do this to them and stuff. 01:07:41.600 --> 01:07:49.150 What stops people from setting up an RSS feed of trusted news sites? 01:07:49.710 --> 01:08:07.210 Setting up a bot that is able to scrape the body of an article without grabbing all the ads and the other junk that's on the page, taking all of that, feeding it to chatGPT, getting chatGPT to rewrite it, and then getting another system that they make to automatically post these. 01:08:07.450 --> 01:08:07.570 Actually, 01:08:07.570 --> 01:08:13.000 is pretty good at it genuinely rewritten articles and then they put their own ads on and then they 01:08:13.000 --> 01:08:19.940 just put their own monetizing someone else's work yep it's all automated yep like and so 01:08:19.940 --> 01:08:27.440 you know what it's not going to completely destroy industries in a day no maybe not even in a year 01:08:27.440 --> 01:08:36.560 give it 10 years i mean even three yeah it's it's gonna be going a very that is already an entire 01:08:36.560 --> 01:08:43.120 news industry yeah but it's usually junk and if you're like paying attention pretty much at all 01:08:43.120 --> 01:08:48.230 you can usually kind of tell no you can a lot of people can't fair enough which is why we're 01:08:48.230 --> 01:08:53.790 but this this moves that bar up quite a bit yeah people have found a few different accounts because 01:08:53.790 --> 01:08:57.830 you can kind of prod them in the right way that people have found a few different twitter accounts 01:08:57.830 --> 01:09:05.290 that are using ai generated faces as their profile that look extremely convincing like you can't tell 01:09:05.290 --> 01:09:06.610 especially at that size 01:09:06.610 --> 01:09:13.930 at that resolution it you really can't tell yeah um and then they have fully chat gpt written tweets 01:09:13.930 --> 01:09:21.020 and replies the whole account and the ones that i have kind of found with with advice from other 01:09:21.020 --> 01:09:26.940 people and how to find them etc etc etc um all of the ones that i've found it looks like people are 01:09:26.940 --> 01:09:34.400 just experimenting i don't think they're really using them to any goal yet yep but yeah it's gonna 01:09:34.400 --> 01:09:36.400 happen yeah we're headed in an interesting direction 01:09:36.400 --> 01:09:36.680 and 01:09:36.700 --> 01:09:41.760 it's hard to find out uh laro does says what about content creators doing this themselves 01:09:41.760 --> 01:09:48.060 to search their podcasts i mean yeah we could sure but what i can tell you is that right now 01:09:48.060 --> 01:09:57.170 there is no like zero effective way to monetize something like this and pretty much any podcast 01:09:57.170 --> 01:10:03.550 that you know and love if it has any kind of monetization on it now if you were to say to 01:10:03.550 --> 01:10:07.130 the creator hey uh why don't you use this tool where people don't use it to monetize something 01:10:07.150 --> 01:10:13.010 don't have to watch the podcast you monetize and they can just get all the information that they need 01:10:13.010 --> 01:10:20.010 without watching it and you monetizing it why don't you do that they're gonna be like why some 01:10:20.010 --> 01:10:25.530 some that like they really don't care about their podcasts as a career path or whatever and they 01:10:25.530 --> 01:10:30.770 just want the information absolutely sure and again i did specify ones that are currently monetized 01:10:30.770 --> 01:10:36.290 okay yeah there you go yeah yeah pretty much um and kai m says i mean ad block is a thing what's 01:10:36.290 --> 01:10:42.450 your take on how this is different to that it's not what his take is on that is pretty documented 01:10:42.450 --> 01:10:47.410 yes i think i think i've been pretty clear about it uh the part that people got confused about 01:10:47.410 --> 01:10:54.370 is i never actually said never use an ad blocker what i said is own it yeah just own it yeah 01:10:54.370 --> 01:11:01.620 understand put on your hat yeah wear your shirt yeah we've even sold a shirt yeah i like it just 01:11:01.620 --> 01:11:06.180 own it it's a nice shirt that's all i said just just just deal with it and if you have like if 01:11:06.180 --> 01:11:11.330 you feel all guilty about the word then maybe that's something then you should do some self 01:11:11.330 --> 01:11:26.790 reflection yeah but yeah otherwise then just yeah just just own it yeah exactly um adfa kls djf 01:11:26.790 --> 01:11:33.430 uh over on Floatplane says i bought two shirts yeah you didn't i don't think yeah we 01:11:34.070 --> 01:11:36.550 very understandably i yeah i will 01:11:36.630 --> 01:11:43.510 say but i don't think we have been doing uh merch message curation at all oh yeah we shoot 01:11:44.070 --> 01:11:49.700 kate um where's Dan uh is Dan still here i don't know 01:11:52.180 --> 01:11:58.500 i'm looking through them right now uh okay uh yeah well hey we've actually got an update on 01:11:58.500 --> 01:12:03.780 LTT Store speaking of ways that we will still be able to survive because we are a mature well 01:12:03.780 --> 01:12:06.580 diversified company i don't mean mature like we don't make fart 01:12:06.660 --> 01:12:13.540 drugs jokes jokes um i mean mature like we have developed a lot of revenue streams to help us 01:12:13.540 --> 01:12:19.380 whether uh you know whatever ai storms are headed this way LTT Store is a huge one uh i think i said 01:12:19.380 --> 01:12:25.540 this before but 2022 is the year that LTT Store's revenue will be greater than our media production 01:12:25.540 --> 01:12:30.580 revenue uh massive shout out to all of you guys for absolutely for making this possible massive 01:12:30.580 --> 01:12:36.180 shout out to the team responsible for it uh nick kyle bridget sarah lloyd oh my goodness i'm gonna 01:12:36.660 --> 01:12:41.300 give you a shout out to all the people it's gonna be really awful uh you know natalie uh adam nolan 01:12:41.300 --> 01:12:44.900 uh there's some new people in customer care i don't know their name yet so i'm not gonna include them 01:12:44.900 --> 01:12:52.900 but you know we got hannah matthew alama day uh the team there is conrad amazing thank you uh 01:12:52.900 --> 01:12:58.340 massive massive shout out to the Floatplane team for making that whole thing happen like it's been 01:12:58.340 --> 01:13:05.860 it's been a long time coming but it means that our future as an independent media company is basically 01:13:06.660 --> 01:13:10.820 a solid foundation for us as a community we've been really proud of our support for you guys 01:13:10.820 --> 01:13:15.220 as we've been really proud of our support for you guys i'd love to see you guys getting back on the 01:13:15.220 --> 01:13:20.580 road and doing great stuff so keep that in mind as long as you guys continue to support us in that 01:13:20.580 --> 01:13:26.900 way uh we've got a deal for you guys this week uh where is it oh wait this just says lttstore.com 01:13:26.900 --> 01:13:31.140 deal of the week question mark i thought we did have something to talk about this week oh 01:13:31.140 --> 01:13:36.500 we have something i didn't talk about last week if nothing else um yeah is that still running we 01:13:36.500 --> 01:13:42.520 can find some hints in the uh in the reviews that that are up we ran this as a promo during the 01:13:42.520 --> 01:13:48.140 black friday's uh period it's yeah that's not the pricing that we're going to be doing for it in the 01:13:48.140 --> 01:13:53.720 long term it's going to be 50 bucks but we've got everything from small to triple xl and you guys 01:13:53.720 --> 01:13:59.820 can check it out mystery hoodie sales are final we do not offer returns or exchanges but it is a 01:13:59.820 --> 01:14:06.660 way to get yourself into an LTT hoodie for a pretty aggressive price uh we're also shipping 01:14:06.660 --> 01:14:11.760 backpacks in real time now they're not backordered in any way uh what else is there that i could 01:14:11.760 --> 01:14:16.320 really say about the store right now i mean yeah i guess that's i guess that's probably that's 01:14:16.320 --> 01:14:21.540 probably enough um all right and uh picking something up on the store is the way to send 01:14:21.540 --> 01:14:24.940 a message into the show they're called merch messages and they're better than super chats 01:14:24.940 --> 01:14:29.200 better than twitch bits because all the money you spend will go into something that you actually get 01:14:29.200 --> 01:14:30.020 to keep and use 01:14:30.020 --> 01:14:36.480 and enjoy instead of lining the pockets of big tech that's our that's our sales pitch and uh 01:14:36.480 --> 01:14:43.100 if youtube and twitch and facebook uh operated the same way as twitter i probably wouldn't be 01:14:43.100 --> 01:14:52.550 allowed to say that but hey we never live streamed on twitter so yeah whatever deal with it oh we 01:14:52.550 --> 01:14:58.030 figured out afterwards you can't periscope's dead right spaces is not the same thing so we couldn't 01:14:58.030 --> 01:15:00.370 yeah yep uh 01:15:00.790 --> 01:15:07.250 uh all right uh i guess we should do a couple have you i have curated some i'm working on going 01:15:07.250 --> 01:15:11.070 through the incoming dance not here so i'm gonna go ahead and uh go through a couple of our curated 01:15:11.070 --> 01:15:15.760 ones and we'll get back to some more topics here should i talk about the big thing that happened 01:15:15.760 --> 01:15:23.590 this year like the really big one the one where we convened like uh a council of people to talk 01:15:23.590 --> 01:15:31.890 about it it's it's past the nda date for it so i could talk about it like the first one the the 01:15:32.010 --> 01:15:38.230 really big event that the really big maybe the really big event that we talked about and ultimately 01:15:38.230 --> 01:15:46.340 decided not to to do no the second event then should we talk about the second big event i'll 01:15:46.340 --> 01:15:50.480 let you think about it while i go through a couple of messages i don't think so i mean i think it 01:15:50.480 --> 01:15:58.160 might be interesting for the people to have some idea it's also the kind of thing that if i worked 01:15:58.160 --> 01:16:02.660 here i probably wouldn't want to hear about it on the WAN Show yeah but i mean are they used to it 01:16:02.660 --> 01:16:05.580 at this point maybe i mean they are but that doesn't mean it's a good thing 01:16:05.780 --> 01:16:16.500 um atomic age a silver on Floatplane says do it cowards i mean i would say the same thing 01:16:16.500 --> 01:16:23.460 if i was in the audience um i do think you should probably discuss this with other internal people 01:16:23.460 --> 01:16:28.460 before we do though james ryan says do you have a recommendation for messaging into the show for 01:16:28.460 --> 01:16:32.900 people who might not want to have a physical object show up uh buy a gift card on LTT Store 01:16:32.900 --> 01:16:37.140 and then just never spend it i guess or spend it eventually or gift 01:16:37.160 --> 01:16:42.340 it it's a gift card yeah give it to someone else it's a gift card yeah at least that way you're not 01:16:42.340 --> 01:16:49.120 throwing away any money yeah right yep don't throw away money because like what's the overhead on 01:16:49.120 --> 01:16:57.260 like uh on a super chat like 30 40 something like that yeah why are you doing that yeah all right 01:16:57.260 --> 01:17:01.660 uh anonymous says hey guys wanting to get into it soon and with the technical difficulties 01:17:01.660 --> 01:17:06.520 experienced tonight i was wondering how help desk issues are solved at LMG is there an official 01:17:06.520 --> 01:17:08.580 ticketing system or just grab the nearest 01:17:08.600 --> 01:17:16.340 Linus uh there's no official ticketing system so you would first go to logistics uh with Dan being 01:17:16.340 --> 01:17:21.460 your main point of contact for that sort of thing and then if he's not around i believe there's 01:17:21.460 --> 01:17:26.980 someone else who is like can kind of be helpful and then it's going to fall to Jake we actually 01:17:26.980 --> 01:17:34.360 have some documentation for catastrophic failures that luke and Jake have been working together on 01:17:34.360 --> 01:17:38.440 so that you'll be you'll have some some docs that you can go to they're not really 01:17:38.760 --> 01:17:43.260 intended for the average user they're intended for more like a me or an Anthony to look at or or 01:17:43.260 --> 01:17:49.140 even people that work on it all the time it's it's mostly a like everything around you is on fire and 01:17:49.140 --> 01:17:54.380 everyone's panicking let me go back to this thing so i don't actually have to think about it so i 01:17:54.380 --> 01:17:59.240 can put my mental power elsewhere and just follow these steps and get everything back online as soon 01:17:59.240 --> 01:18:03.500 as possible it also like organizes all the information that you need does stuff like that 01:18:03.500 --> 01:18:07.280 it's a good idea to have disaster recovery procedures it's something that i think we could 01:18:07.280 --> 01:18:08.900 do better but it's something that 01:18:09.080 --> 01:18:15.440 also is working reasonably well for us um i think that because we are a company of relatively tech 01:18:15.440 --> 01:18:22.480 savvy people we probably have a lot fewer i can't figure out how to open my email client 01:18:22.480 --> 01:18:27.040 my computer won't turn on oh it's not plugged in yeah then many companies would so it hasn't 01:18:27.040 --> 01:18:32.560 overloaded those guys yet but as we expand into more say for example like physical goods 01:18:32.560 --> 01:18:36.960 manufacturing where we can't expect people to have a high level of technical proficiency like maybe 01:18:36.960 --> 01:18:38.640 they're a wizard with a sewing machine 01:18:39.560 --> 01:18:44.040 but you know a computer what's a compute right i i don't i don't know then we might have to deal 01:18:44.040 --> 01:18:50.620 with more of that and it might be something that we'll have to address um kevin m can you test 01:18:50.620 --> 01:18:56.700 whether lifting a laptop by its palm rest causes a mouse click to register i frequently carry around 01:18:56.700 --> 01:19:00.620 my laptop while watching full screen videos and it's frustrating having them pause all the time 01:19:00.620 --> 01:19:05.420 both my xps 15 and my lg gram do this so i curated this i thought it was actually kind 01:19:05.420 --> 01:19:09.740 of an interesting question because i have experienced this before me too so like maybe 01:19:09.820 --> 01:19:14.460 something interesting for the Labs to consider if they start getting into laptop testing it could 01:19:14.460 --> 01:19:20.860 even be like a mostly pass fail like if by lifting it at any point in these sort of designated areas 01:19:20.860 --> 01:19:27.500 it causes a mouse click to register um then fail kind of thing yeah yeah it's an interesting 01:19:27.500 --> 01:19:32.060 interesting idea all right i'm going to submit that to gary 01:19:33.220 --> 01:19:36.740 uh you might have to do the next one because i'm typing an email okay i'm actually going 01:19:36.740 --> 01:19:40.660 to do one that isn't curated yet but i was just going to curate it uh so this is from colin r he 01:19:41.060 --> 01:19:46.100 asks what what are your thoughts on the potential of ai generated video game assets do you think 01:19:46.100 --> 01:19:54.790 that oh i found it again do you think that engines like unity or unreal engine will develop tools for 01:19:54.790 --> 01:20:01.110 easy integration of ai generated assets in the workflow uh i think they are absolutely going to 01:20:01.110 --> 01:20:06.470 be a thing i would highly suspect that both of those engines will eventually find some form of 01:20:06.470 --> 01:20:11.990 integration uh including the potentiality of that integration just being a tool that is built into 01:20:12.630 --> 01:20:20.150 i have already seen examples of people using chat gpt input prompts into something i don't remember 01:20:20.150 --> 01:20:26.870 what it was it was some ai art program thingamajigger and it was making texture maps 01:20:26.870 --> 01:20:33.430 for models that they made in 3d yeah um i saw that too like cad software so they were modeling 01:20:33.430 --> 01:20:38.070 like buildings and or they were texturing like buildings and stuff some of them were 01:20:38.070 --> 01:20:42.470 surprisingly good does it look perfect no no 01:20:42.630 --> 01:20:44.810 But I've seen games that were worse. 01:20:44.810 --> 01:20:46.610 I've seen finished games that were a lot worse. 01:20:46.610 --> 01:20:48.390 Relatively modern ones too. 01:20:48.390 --> 01:20:53.580 Like, yeah, it's 100% gonna be a thing for sure. 01:20:53.580 --> 01:20:54.680 Stable diffusion, was that it? 01:20:54.680 --> 01:20:56.220 Yeah, I think a bunch of people saw this. 01:20:56.220 --> 01:20:59.370 It was relatively trendy, so yeah. 01:20:59.370 --> 01:21:00.910 Absolutely wild. 01:21:00.910 --> 01:21:02.630 All right, you guys have got some more time 01:21:02.630 --> 01:21:05.030 to send in some merch messages. 01:21:05.030 --> 01:21:06.230 The producer's back. 01:21:06.230 --> 01:21:07.710 Sup, Dan? 01:21:07.710 --> 01:21:08.550 Hello. 01:21:08.550 --> 01:21:13.550 How are, how are the, yeah. 01:21:15.590 --> 01:21:16.430 Look at him. 01:21:18.430 --> 01:21:19.630 Yeah. 01:21:19.630 --> 01:21:21.750 Dan, you've seen better days, my friend. 01:21:21.750 --> 01:21:23.870 I live for this stuff, don't you worry. 01:21:23.870 --> 01:21:25.290 Yeah, hell yeah. 01:21:25.290 --> 01:21:26.130 Oh yeah. 01:21:26.130 --> 01:21:26.970 Let's go. 01:21:26.970 --> 01:21:29.950 This has been an absolute poo show today. 01:21:29.950 --> 01:21:31.330 To be fair, this is good stuff. 01:21:31.330 --> 01:21:33.990 Yeah, we appreciate you guys sticking with us 01:21:33.990 --> 01:21:35.450 through the technical difficulties. 01:21:35.450 --> 01:21:38.230 For once, it wasn't our fault at all. 01:21:38.230 --> 01:21:38.510 And I think- 01:21:38.510 --> 01:21:39.950 I think the response to it was pretty good. 01:21:39.950 --> 01:21:41.870 We, you know what? 01:21:41.870 --> 01:21:42.710 If it hadn't been- 01:21:42.710 --> 01:21:43.550 Was it flawless? 01:21:43.550 --> 01:21:47.550 If it hadn't been for a thing that I can't really disclose 01:21:47.550 --> 01:21:50.790 that is special about the WAN Show setup, 01:21:50.790 --> 01:21:52.210 I don't think our, 01:21:52.210 --> 01:21:53.910 I don't think our stream would have even stopped. 01:21:53.910 --> 01:21:55.030 Wouldn't even have coughed, no. 01:21:55.030 --> 01:21:56.890 It was just that, that was the only problem. 01:21:56.890 --> 01:21:58.810 And we will have that addressed for next time. 01:21:58.810 --> 01:22:01.050 It was just one of those things we just didn't, 01:22:01.050 --> 01:22:03.890 we didn't think about that the WAN Show 01:22:03.890 --> 01:22:06.010 will need to continue through a power outage. 01:22:06.010 --> 01:22:07.430 Like, we are set up so that, in the end, 01:22:07.430 --> 01:22:08.270 we're gonna be able to do it. 01:22:08.270 --> 01:22:10.510 In the event of a long-term power outage, 01:22:10.510 --> 01:22:11.650 we can at least finish, 01:22:11.650 --> 01:22:14.270 we can have one editor finish today's video. 01:22:14.270 --> 01:22:18.100 That's kind of the, that's the bar, right? 01:22:18.100 --> 01:22:20.140 And everyone else can shut down their work, 01:22:20.140 --> 01:22:22.940 or shut down their computers and save their work safely. 01:22:24.570 --> 01:22:29.590 But now that we know that we could do this, 01:22:29.590 --> 01:22:32.870 I'm thinking daisy chain jacqueries. 01:22:32.870 --> 01:22:34.750 I'm thinking backup batteries 01:22:34.750 --> 01:22:36.910 on all the key pieces of infrastructure. 01:22:36.910 --> 01:22:39.450 Let's go, power off WAN Show. 01:22:40.290 --> 01:22:42.490 Yeah, we can do about three and a half hours. 01:22:42.490 --> 01:22:43.330 Yeah. 01:22:43.330 --> 01:22:47.530 Which is, I mean, a lot of WAN shows get pretty close 01:22:47.530 --> 01:22:48.370 to that these days. 01:22:48.370 --> 01:22:49.210 Yeah, but not longer. 01:22:49.210 --> 01:22:50.450 But they don't go past that, yeah. 01:22:50.450 --> 01:22:52.250 Yeah, oh, I'm excited. 01:22:52.250 --> 01:22:53.830 I'm excited, this is great. 01:22:54.710 --> 01:22:57.840 All right, what else do we got today? 01:22:57.840 --> 01:23:02.330 Apple to allow third-party app stores and sideloading 01:23:02.330 --> 01:23:03.630 in Europe due to Digital Markets Act. 01:23:03.630 --> 01:23:06.290 We talked about this a little bit last week, 01:23:06.290 --> 01:23:07.950 but it hadn't been fleshed out in the doc 01:23:07.950 --> 01:23:09.910 because of a miscommunication, so we're gonna get into it 01:23:09.910 --> 01:23:10.670 in a little bit more detail. 01:23:10.670 --> 01:23:11.970 One really quick thing. 01:23:11.970 --> 01:23:13.670 Dan, are you on Merch Messages now? 01:23:13.670 --> 01:23:14.830 I'm trying my best. 01:23:14.830 --> 01:23:15.670 Got it. 01:23:15.670 --> 01:23:17.050 If you guys can help, that'd be great. 01:23:17.050 --> 01:23:17.870 Okay. 01:23:17.870 --> 01:23:19.870 Apple has signaled that it will abide 01:23:19.870 --> 01:23:21.870 the EU's Digital Markets Act 01:23:21.870 --> 01:23:26.870 and allow third-party app stores and sideloading on iDevices. 01:23:26.870 --> 01:23:30.010 This is exciting. 01:23:30.010 --> 01:23:33.330 The DMA is intended to prevent abuse of market power 01:23:33.330 --> 01:23:35.550 and allow new players to enter digital markets, 01:23:35.550 --> 01:23:40.170 basically leveling the playing field against big tech. 01:23:40.170 --> 01:23:42.170 It was signed into law in September, 01:23:42.170 --> 01:23:43.930 came into effect in November, 01:23:43.930 --> 01:23:46.470 and active enforcement will begin in May. 01:23:46.470 --> 01:23:49.170 That is a fast timeline for such a... 01:23:49.170 --> 01:23:50.170 That is a very fast timeline. 01:23:50.170 --> 01:23:52.970 Such an earth-shaking change to the way 01:23:52.970 --> 01:23:56.210 that these digital markets have worked up until now. 01:23:56.210 --> 01:23:59.470 Apple's objections to date have been numerous. 01:23:59.470 --> 01:24:01.790 It will be confusing for users. 01:24:01.790 --> 01:24:04.410 It will be a gold rush for the malware industry 01:24:04.410 --> 01:24:06.930 and a cyber criminal's best friend. 01:24:06.930 --> 01:24:09.370 This would destroy the security of the iPhone. 01:24:10.200 --> 01:24:13.360 I'll be very interested to see if Apple's marketing 01:24:13.360 --> 01:24:16.140 around the security of the iPhone changes. 01:24:16.140 --> 01:24:19.000 I'm willing to bet they don't say the iPhone is not secure. 01:24:19.000 --> 01:24:19.840 Yeah. 01:24:19.840 --> 01:24:20.680 Hmm. 01:24:20.680 --> 01:24:22.640 So maybe they can overcome this after all. 01:24:22.640 --> 01:24:24.500 Oh, interesting. 01:24:24.500 --> 01:24:27.060 And they said Android experiences 01:24:27.060 --> 01:24:29.790 five million attacks per month. 01:24:29.790 --> 01:24:30.730 Okay. 01:24:30.730 --> 01:24:31.990 Yeah. 01:24:31.990 --> 01:24:33.110 And? 01:24:33.110 --> 01:24:34.030 How many do they? 01:24:34.030 --> 01:24:34.870 Yeah. 01:24:34.870 --> 01:24:37.830 Incidentally, the news triggered a stock surge 01:24:37.830 --> 01:24:40.290 for dating services and apps. 01:24:40.290 --> 01:24:41.130 Oh, wow. 01:24:41.130 --> 01:24:42.910 You'll finally be able to have like, say for example, 01:24:42.910 --> 01:24:45.290 a pornography app on the app store. 01:24:45.290 --> 01:24:46.130 Yeah. 01:24:46.130 --> 01:24:49.530 Like Apple has long taken a moral high ground 01:24:49.530 --> 01:24:50.950 against certain types of content. 01:24:50.950 --> 01:24:52.090 Interesting. 01:24:52.090 --> 01:24:57.190 Well, unless it's in Safari web browser, 01:24:57.190 --> 01:24:59.630 nobody can use Apple software and hardware 01:24:59.630 --> 01:25:02.980 to view such things. 01:25:02.980 --> 01:25:04.180 Get real, guys. 01:25:05.890 --> 01:25:09.130 While this is broadly seen as a victory for consumers, 01:25:09.130 --> 01:25:11.350 some are less sure. 01:25:11.510 --> 01:25:13.890 Sami Fathi, a writer for MacRumors, 01:25:13.890 --> 01:25:15.510 says that many questions remain 01:25:15.510 --> 01:25:17.350 on how Apple might implement this 01:25:17.350 --> 01:25:19.710 and suggests that it might, in effect, 01:25:19.710 --> 01:25:21.670 force people to sideload. 01:25:23.210 --> 01:25:25.890 Apps must be able to access services and sensors 01:25:25.890 --> 01:25:28.050 and sideloading could offer greater control for apps 01:25:28.050 --> 01:25:30.310 than the app store's restrictions allow. 01:25:30.310 --> 01:25:34.170 I have no idea what Sami's point is right now. 01:25:34.170 --> 01:25:36.930 Companies like Meta and Spotify are incentivized to leave 01:25:36.930 --> 01:25:38.970 as they're in direct competition with Apple 01:25:38.970 --> 01:25:41.170 and chafe under app store's rules. 01:25:41.170 --> 01:25:42.010 Yeah. 01:25:42.010 --> 01:25:43.550 So, no, what's actually going to happen 01:25:43.550 --> 01:25:47.330 is in order for Apple to maintain any kind of revenue 01:25:47.330 --> 01:25:48.470 from the app store, 01:25:48.470 --> 01:25:53.010 they're going to have to take a less abusive cut 01:25:53.010 --> 01:25:57.800 and they're going to have to relax their policies. 01:25:57.800 --> 01:25:58.660 It's good. 01:25:58.660 --> 01:25:59.760 This is good for consumers. 01:25:59.760 --> 01:26:01.080 All you're doing is, 01:26:01.080 --> 01:26:02.580 Sami, all you're doing is reiterating 01:26:02.580 --> 01:26:04.080 why this is good for consumers. 01:26:06.980 --> 01:26:07.800 Okay. 01:26:07.800 --> 01:26:09.240 Bit odd. 01:26:09.240 --> 01:26:10.240 This is a problem. 01:26:10.240 --> 01:26:11.360 This is a really good point. 01:26:11.360 --> 01:26:14.480 Making sure that people are running the latest app revision 01:26:14.480 --> 01:26:17.980 this way is going to be a major issue for developers 01:26:17.980 --> 01:26:20.740 versus just having the app store manage this. 01:26:21.620 --> 01:26:23.660 That's going to be messy. 01:26:23.660 --> 01:26:24.740 And then this third point, 01:26:24.740 --> 01:26:26.360 basically it's a mess all around. 01:26:26.360 --> 01:26:27.940 I disagree. 01:26:29.060 --> 01:26:30.940 Android already allows sideloading. 01:26:30.940 --> 01:26:33.660 No, it is not a mess all around. 01:26:33.660 --> 01:26:39.040 Most users, I promise you, don't sideload anything. 01:26:39.040 --> 01:26:41.120 And it'll probably be the same way. 01:26:41.120 --> 01:26:42.120 But, 01:26:42.120 --> 01:26:45.040 if Apple has major cash cow apps come to them, 01:26:45.040 --> 01:26:47.880 one after another, after another, after another, 01:26:47.880 --> 01:26:51.880 this is finally a way for partners to put pressure on Apple, 01:26:51.880 --> 01:26:59.480 to actually be partners rather than servants of Apple, 01:26:59.480 --> 01:27:02.540 rather than just being grateful that Apple gives them 01:27:02.540 --> 01:27:07.320 the privilege of being part of their fiefdom or whatever. 01:27:10.000 --> 01:27:12.080 Limited sideloading is already a thing on iOS. 01:27:12.080 --> 01:27:14.040 So yeah, things might not change that much. 01:27:14.040 --> 01:27:16.240 But right now it's very restrictive. 01:27:16.240 --> 01:27:18.460 Users have to import a certificate to do so. 01:27:18.460 --> 01:27:20.240 It has to be refreshed weekly to function 01:27:20.240 --> 01:27:21.540 if you aren't a developer. 01:27:21.540 --> 01:27:23.200 There's an app limit of three. 01:27:24.960 --> 01:27:26.320 AltStore, I've never even heard of this, 01:27:26.320 --> 01:27:27.880 is apparently a third party app store 01:27:27.880 --> 01:27:30.500 that automatically refreshes the certificates. 01:27:30.500 --> 01:27:33.240 Now this discussion question, who's right here and why, 01:27:33.240 --> 01:27:35.920 I think I've made my position pretty clear. 01:27:35.920 --> 01:27:37.840 This is a win for consumer choice. 01:27:37.840 --> 01:27:39.320 And again, this is one of those things 01:27:39.320 --> 01:27:42.040 where if you're an Apple user who wants to only use 01:27:42.040 --> 01:27:44.000 the app store, then by all means, 01:27:44.000 --> 01:27:47.000 you should have no objection to this for everyone else 01:27:47.000 --> 01:27:50.500 because you can keep just using the app store. 01:27:50.500 --> 01:27:52.460 Go for it. 01:27:52.460 --> 01:27:54.800 I don't want to. 01:27:54.800 --> 01:27:59.040 And I don't like Apple's monopolistic behavior. 01:27:59.040 --> 01:28:02.040 So I might choose to do something else. 01:28:02.040 --> 01:28:03.960 It's called consumer choice. 01:28:03.960 --> 01:28:06.600 You have the choice to do it that way. 01:28:06.600 --> 01:28:11.180 And this is effectively a legislative body stepping in 01:28:11.180 --> 01:28:14.640 and saying, yeah, Apple has not in good faith provided 01:28:14.640 --> 01:28:17.720 consumer choice, has not in good faith put themselves 01:28:17.720 --> 01:28:19.940 on a level playing field with their competitors 01:28:19.940 --> 01:28:23.520 on their ecosystem and has behaved in a monopolistic way. 01:28:24.590 --> 01:28:27.130 If they had acted in good faith, 01:28:27.130 --> 01:28:29.030 this probably wouldn't have come to bite them, 01:28:29.030 --> 01:28:30.950 but they didn't and so it has. 01:28:30.950 --> 01:28:33.680 Too bad. 01:28:33.680 --> 01:28:34.600 I don't feel bad for them. 01:28:34.600 --> 01:28:35.600 I just can't. 01:28:35.600 --> 01:28:38.440 They've been just arseholes to deal with. 01:28:38.440 --> 01:28:40.400 Yeah, absolutely. 01:28:40.400 --> 01:28:41.400 At like every turn. 01:28:41.400 --> 01:28:42.400 They've made their bed. 01:28:42.400 --> 01:28:43.440 Now they sleep in it. 01:28:43.440 --> 01:28:44.280 Yeah. 01:28:44.280 --> 01:28:45.320 I'm glad the EU actually 01:28:45.320 --> 01:28:47.600 has the stones to do this. 01:28:47.600 --> 01:28:49.100 Now, the next discussion question is, 01:28:49.100 --> 01:28:50.780 what would a more open iPhone look like? 01:28:50.780 --> 01:28:53.360 Would you be more or less likely to buy one 01:28:53.360 --> 01:28:57.320 if it supported third-party app stores and sideloading? 01:28:57.320 --> 01:29:00.560 Because man, with sideloading, I'm imagining anyway, 01:29:00.560 --> 01:29:03.100 a lot more functionality that I just can't get 01:29:03.100 --> 01:29:05.560 unless I want to jailbreak this stupid thing. 01:29:05.560 --> 01:29:07.820 Yeah, I think it really depends. 01:29:07.820 --> 01:29:12.080 It depends what services start putting themselves up 01:29:12.080 --> 01:29:12.920 to be sideloaded. 01:29:12.920 --> 01:29:16.260 It depends if users really start actually doing it 01:29:16.260 --> 01:29:19.880 at all, because if users don't do it, 01:29:19.880 --> 01:29:22.640 then companies aren't going to bother running that setup anyways. 01:29:22.640 --> 01:29:24.840 Like there's a lot of variables there. 01:29:24.840 --> 01:29:26.920 I think it's one of those things where like first generation 01:29:26.920 --> 01:29:29.420 of it might not necessarily matter too much, 01:29:29.420 --> 01:29:34.720 but it'll be interesting to see how it evolves over time. 01:29:34.720 --> 01:29:37.040 I have another discussion question. 01:29:37.040 --> 01:29:41.040 Would Flowplane just immediately go the sideloading route 01:29:41.040 --> 01:29:43.300 or would we try and stay on the app store? 01:29:43.300 --> 01:29:45.060 Because I know which way I lean right now, 01:29:45.060 --> 01:29:48.500 but let's have executive dialogue here. 01:29:48.500 --> 01:29:50.120 Let's talk about synergies. 01:29:50.120 --> 01:29:54.260 One problem with sideloading and one of the reasons 01:29:54.260 --> 01:29:56.500 why we've avoided sending out packages like that 01:29:56.500 --> 01:29:57.620 in the past is updates. 01:29:57.620 --> 01:29:59.040 Yeah, absolutely. 01:29:59.040 --> 01:30:00.880 We don't have an in-app updater. 01:30:00.880 --> 01:30:02.200 That is something that is possible, 01:30:02.200 --> 01:30:03.740 but that is a tool that we would have to make. 01:30:03.740 --> 01:30:04.580 Which costs money. 01:30:04.580 --> 01:30:05.740 Yeah. 01:30:05.740 --> 01:30:08.260 So I don't know, it really depends. 01:30:08.260 --> 01:30:13.260 I could definitely see someone making like some open source 01:30:14.120 --> 01:30:17.580 like package updater for iPhones or something. 01:30:17.580 --> 01:30:18.420 Yeah. 01:30:18.420 --> 01:30:19.340 Or like an updated app store. 01:30:19.340 --> 01:30:20.180 Or that. 01:30:20.180 --> 01:30:21.420 Might have their own updater, yep. 01:30:21.420 --> 01:30:22.260 Yeah. 01:30:22.260 --> 01:30:25.080 So if, I mean, there's a lot of potential there. 01:30:27.650 --> 01:30:30.430 There's definitely a lot more we could do with the app. 01:30:30.430 --> 01:30:32.970 If we could just let it get sideloaded. 01:30:34.110 --> 01:30:36.050 There's a lot of things that we've been stopped from doing. 01:30:36.050 --> 01:30:37.690 Like we'll get complaints. 01:30:37.690 --> 01:30:39.510 People will email customer support and they're like, 01:30:39.510 --> 01:30:41.710 hey, this isn't very intuitive. 01:30:41.710 --> 01:30:44.490 It's like, you are 100% correct. 01:30:44.490 --> 01:30:46.250 I completely agree with you. 01:30:46.250 --> 01:30:48.570 And I apologize that there's nothing we can do about it. 01:30:48.570 --> 01:30:49.410 Yeah. 01:30:49.410 --> 01:30:50.570 Like we can't. 01:30:50.570 --> 01:30:52.170 They're like, it would be really great 01:30:52.170 --> 01:30:54.210 if when I go to try to do this thing, 01:30:54.210 --> 01:30:56.650 it could tell me that like I have to do it on the website. 01:30:56.650 --> 01:30:59.070 And it's like, yep, that would be awesome. 01:30:59.070 --> 01:30:59.910 But we can't. 01:30:59.910 --> 01:31:02.330 We can't send you to our website, sorry. 01:31:02.330 --> 01:31:03.170 It is what it is. 01:31:03.170 --> 01:31:04.010 Ridiculous. 01:31:04.010 --> 01:31:05.250 Yeah, it's just. 01:31:05.250 --> 01:31:08.030 And they've gotten a little bit better with it over time. 01:31:08.030 --> 01:31:09.870 But like, it's still far from 01:31:09.870 --> 01:31:12.810 what I would consider acceptable. 01:31:12.810 --> 01:31:15.540 Yeah. 01:31:15.540 --> 01:31:18.960 I think merch messages are much more under control. 01:31:18.960 --> 01:31:21.600 There's three potentials. 01:31:21.600 --> 01:31:23.480 No incoming, and then we have 15 curated. 01:31:23.480 --> 01:31:29.140 So we have a lot to go through, but the wave has subsided. 01:31:29.140 --> 01:31:32.540 Let me jump through a couple of these really quickly. 01:31:32.540 --> 01:31:36.000 Epic Games is gonna be paying half a billion dollars 01:31:36.000 --> 01:31:39.500 for COPPA violations and the use of dark patterns. 01:31:39.500 --> 01:31:41.180 Are you familiar with dark patterns? 01:31:41.180 --> 01:31:42.000 Yeah. 01:31:42.000 --> 01:31:42.840 I would think that you would be. 01:31:42.840 --> 01:31:43.680 Good. 01:31:43.680 --> 01:31:44.500 Then why don't you explain them? 01:31:44.500 --> 01:31:45.340 Because you probably know more about them than I do. 01:31:45.340 --> 01:31:47.140 So a dark pattern, 01:31:47.140 --> 01:31:49.800 and I apologize if I explain this poorly, 01:31:49.800 --> 01:31:51.700 but a dark pattern is like, 01:31:52.300 --> 01:31:56.800 trying to mislead or trick users in certain ways. 01:31:56.800 --> 01:31:57.640 Yeah. 01:31:57.640 --> 01:32:02.420 Like manipulate your website or your service so that. 01:32:02.420 --> 01:32:04.060 Manipulate the appearance of things, 01:32:04.060 --> 01:32:05.920 manipulate the user experience of things 01:32:05.920 --> 01:32:08.060 like where you position different buttons, 01:32:08.060 --> 01:32:10.100 manipulate things to try to funnel people 01:32:10.100 --> 01:32:11.460 in a certain direction, 01:32:11.460 --> 01:32:14.720 which is probably not something that they would want to do. 01:32:14.720 --> 01:32:15.560 Yeah. 01:32:15.560 --> 01:32:18.760 So like if you kind of obscure your sign up 01:32:18.760 --> 01:32:20.420 to a newsletter thing, 01:32:20.420 --> 01:32:21.300 and it's a checkbox, 01:32:21.300 --> 01:32:22.260 and it's automatically checked, 01:32:22.260 --> 01:32:23.260 but it's like really small 01:32:23.260 --> 01:32:24.600 and it's somewhere that you wouldn't expect. 01:32:24.600 --> 01:32:25.460 That'd be a dark pattern. 01:32:25.460 --> 01:32:26.300 That would be a dark pattern. 01:32:26.300 --> 01:32:31.500 Or if you have like a buy now button, okay, 01:32:31.500 --> 01:32:33.600 for a product someone might want. 01:32:33.600 --> 01:32:35.220 And then in very small text, 01:32:35.220 --> 01:32:38.420 it says you authorize us to send you one of these every month. 01:32:38.420 --> 01:32:39.260 Yeah. 01:32:39.260 --> 01:32:40.180 And you didn't realize that you were. 01:32:40.180 --> 01:32:41.020 Recurring subscription. 01:32:41.020 --> 01:32:42.460 Signing up for a subscription service. 01:32:42.460 --> 01:32:44.600 That would be a dark pattern. 01:32:44.600 --> 01:32:49.600 So it's using subtlety to get users to do inputs 01:32:49.920 --> 01:32:51.720 that are not what they actually want. 01:32:51.720 --> 01:32:56.480 So $245 million of the settlement 01:32:56.480 --> 01:32:59.960 is in refunds for dark patterns and billing practices 01:32:59.960 --> 01:33:02.060 that essentially made it too easy 01:33:02.060 --> 01:33:03.640 to make purchases in game, 01:33:03.640 --> 01:33:06.520 often accidentally, according to the FTC. 01:33:06.520 --> 01:33:08.880 It is claimed that Epic would intentionally 01:33:08.880 --> 01:33:12.100 switch button positions to create situations 01:33:12.100 --> 01:33:15.300 where charges were made with a single button press. 01:33:15.300 --> 01:33:16.420 Charges would also be made 01:33:16.420 --> 01:33:18.340 when the game would be woken from sleep mode 01:33:18.340 --> 01:33:20.960 through these dark patterns of deceitful UI. 01:33:20.960 --> 01:33:23.620 Until 2018, Epic would allow charges to be made 01:33:23.620 --> 01:33:25.880 without cardholder action or approval. 01:33:25.880 --> 01:33:29.960 So by default, simple button presses would lead to charges. 01:33:29.960 --> 01:33:32.940 The rest of it is for violating 01:33:32.940 --> 01:33:35.720 the Children's Online Privacy Protection Act, COPPA, 01:33:35.720 --> 01:33:38.020 by not including adequate parental controls, 01:33:38.020 --> 01:33:39.720 collecting children's personal information 01:33:39.720 --> 01:33:41.400 without parental consent, 01:33:41.400 --> 01:33:43.820 and using overly relaxed privacy settings 01:33:43.820 --> 01:33:47.220 that included text and voice chat being active by default, 01:33:47.220 --> 01:33:50.520 which I think we can all agree is not good. 01:33:51.060 --> 01:33:55.950 I don't want to hear their annoying voices. 01:33:55.950 --> 01:33:57.610 Sorry, what were you talking about? 01:33:59.030 --> 01:34:01.150 Other examples, by the way, can include things like, 01:34:01.150 --> 01:34:03.310 some of these were brought up in Floatplane chat. 01:34:03.310 --> 01:34:05.450 If you're trying to unsubscribe from something, 01:34:05.450 --> 01:34:07.810 the cancel button being really big and obvious 01:34:07.810 --> 01:34:10.110 and the unsubscribe button being a hyperlink 01:34:10.110 --> 01:34:12.110 that you can barely even tell is a button, 01:34:13.190 --> 01:34:16.070 one that you see fairly often with subscriptions. 01:34:16.070 --> 01:34:20.410 Man, I was, okay, so a little while ago, 01:34:22.110 --> 01:34:25.450 my grandfather passed away and we were going through 01:34:25.450 --> 01:34:27.690 and canceling some of his online subscriptions 01:34:27.690 --> 01:34:30.490 and accounts and things, and he had Amazon Prime. 01:34:30.490 --> 01:34:34.380 Canceling Amazon Prime is hard. 01:34:34.380 --> 01:34:36.380 Why is it so hard? 01:34:36.380 --> 01:34:38.760 Because Daddy Bezos needs more yachts. 01:34:38.760 --> 01:34:42.840 And I legitimately think, I almost, man, I had told myself 01:34:42.840 --> 01:34:44.260 I wanted to rage on the WAN Show about this, 01:34:44.260 --> 01:34:45.700 and I think I forgot about it, 01:34:45.700 --> 01:34:50.120 but I think it's genuinely like oppressive to old people. 01:34:50.120 --> 01:34:50.960 Yeah. 01:34:50.960 --> 01:34:52.380 Because it's really confusing. 01:34:52.380 --> 01:34:55.140 And they move around where you need 01:34:55.140 --> 01:34:56.380 to press the cancel button, 01:34:56.380 --> 01:34:58.880 and they frame it in a bunch of really weird ways. 01:34:58.880 --> 01:35:01.680 And the website feels like it degrades. 01:35:01.680 --> 01:35:04.260 It feels like you go back to 1990s internet, 01:35:04.260 --> 01:35:06.420 because you get these weird ancient UIs 01:35:06.420 --> 01:35:07.260 as you're going through. 01:35:07.260 --> 01:35:09.300 And it's very weird. 01:35:09.300 --> 01:35:11.720 You feel like you're doing something wrong. 01:35:13.800 --> 01:35:16.580 It's so not okay, in my opinion. 01:35:16.580 --> 01:35:17.420 I don't know. 01:35:17.420 --> 01:35:19.220 It actually bothered me a lot. 01:35:19.220 --> 01:35:22.380 I already don't exactly have the most positive 01:35:22.380 --> 01:35:26.620 relationship with Amazon, so I do have to consider that. 01:35:26.620 --> 01:35:29.080 But it was actually really terrible. 01:35:29.080 --> 01:35:31.080 Yeah, Luke was probably in more of a hurry 01:35:31.080 --> 01:35:34.000 to cancel a Prime subscription than most people would be. 01:35:34.000 --> 01:35:36.260 Yeah, that's probably fair enough. 01:35:36.260 --> 01:35:39.800 But another thing, and this is not a drag on him, 01:35:39.800 --> 01:35:44.040 he had multiple Amazon accounts that we ended up figuring out. 01:35:44.040 --> 01:35:45.920 It's really easy to accidentally do that. 01:35:45.920 --> 01:35:49.860 Had multiple Prime subscriptions. 01:35:49.860 --> 01:35:51.640 It should be way harder to do that. 01:35:51.640 --> 01:35:52.600 Yep. 01:35:52.600 --> 01:35:53.780 Like, I just, man. 01:35:53.780 --> 01:35:55.120 I don't know. 01:35:55.120 --> 01:35:56.900 Someone in full-plane chat just said, 01:35:56.900 --> 01:36:00.940 I'm a sysadmin, and it took me 20 minutes to cancel Prime. 01:36:00.940 --> 01:36:01.860 That should be one click. 01:36:01.860 --> 01:36:04.960 That should not be okay. 01:36:04.960 --> 01:36:06.500 Like, that's actually crazy. 01:36:06.500 --> 01:36:07.920 I don't know. 01:36:07.920 --> 01:36:10.260 In my opinion, that's an extremely egregious version 01:36:10.260 --> 01:36:12.040 of like a dark pattern. 01:36:12.040 --> 01:36:15.340 Yeah, it's trying to push people to not do the thing 01:36:15.340 --> 01:36:18.410 that you don't want them to do. 01:36:18.410 --> 01:36:19.750 So, yeah. 01:36:21.390 --> 01:36:25.010 I just wanted to read this comment from Jedi2, 01:36:25.010 --> 01:36:26.310 tagging Dan. 01:36:26.310 --> 01:36:27.890 You guys handled the outage well. 01:36:27.890 --> 01:36:30.090 Very impressed the show wasn't canceled tonight. 01:36:30.090 --> 01:36:32.130 Luke and I have a streak, okay? 01:36:32.130 --> 01:36:33.630 Yeah, it's not allowed to happen. 01:36:33.630 --> 01:36:35.710 It never entered my mind 01:36:35.710 --> 01:36:38.770 that the show was not going to go on tonight. 01:36:38.770 --> 01:36:41.710 I will not be responsible for breaking the streak. 01:36:41.710 --> 01:36:45.810 No one here is gonna be the one to break the streak. 01:36:45.810 --> 01:36:49.010 I was told that I have too much vacation time recently, 01:36:49.010 --> 01:36:50.630 so I had to book some vacation time. 01:36:50.630 --> 01:36:53.010 And when I was trying to figure out when I could book it, 01:36:53.010 --> 01:36:54.510 I was describing like, okay, I could do these things. 01:36:54.510 --> 01:36:55.810 I could do these things, whatever. 01:36:55.810 --> 01:36:57.270 I was like, I can't take Fridays off. 01:36:57.270 --> 01:36:58.630 It's just, it's not an option. 01:36:58.630 --> 01:37:03.010 I was like, WAN Show must go on. 01:37:03.010 --> 01:37:05.630 When I was traveling, I technically had those Fridays off, 01:37:05.630 --> 01:37:07.270 but I was just like, no. 01:37:07.270 --> 01:37:08.930 I'm on vacation this week. 01:37:08.930 --> 01:37:10.810 Yeah, perfect example. 01:37:10.810 --> 01:37:11.630 You know that. 01:37:11.630 --> 01:37:12.930 Yeah, it's gonna happen. 01:37:12.930 --> 01:37:14.170 WAN Show must go on. 01:37:14.170 --> 01:37:15.970 I'm on vacation right now. 01:37:16.970 --> 01:37:17.810 What's up? 01:37:20.810 --> 01:37:22.810 Speaking of things that might have brought people 01:37:22.810 --> 01:37:23.810 back from vacation. 01:37:24.510 --> 01:37:26.430 This isn't really properly in the doc, 01:37:26.430 --> 01:37:30.170 but the write-up by Scotty Seng on the forum is quite good. 01:37:30.170 --> 01:37:31.890 So we're gonna use that. 01:37:31.890 --> 01:37:33.710 Alert for LastPass users. 01:37:33.710 --> 01:37:37.350 The breach in August was worse than expected. 01:37:37.350 --> 01:37:38.390 A lot worse. 01:37:38.390 --> 01:37:39.510 I use LastPass. 01:37:39.510 --> 01:37:41.170 I've hated it for so long, 01:37:41.170 --> 01:37:42.850 but I have assigned the task 01:37:42.850 --> 01:37:45.430 of switching our corporate password manager 01:37:45.430 --> 01:37:47.930 over to something else to multiple people 01:37:47.930 --> 01:37:49.630 for like almost two years now. 01:37:49.630 --> 01:37:50.550 And it hasn't been done. 01:37:50.550 --> 01:37:51.750 Actually over a year. 01:37:51.750 --> 01:37:53.510 I think I'm gonna take the mantle. 01:37:53.510 --> 01:37:54.350 Are you? 01:37:54.350 --> 01:37:55.190 That would be great. 01:37:55.190 --> 01:37:56.010 Thanks. 01:37:56.010 --> 01:37:56.850 Yeah. 01:37:56.850 --> 01:37:57.690 Can we go with, 01:37:57.690 --> 01:38:00.230 is KeePass the one that has the local nonsense? 01:38:00.230 --> 01:38:01.050 I don't know. 01:38:01.050 --> 01:38:01.850 Well, I want that one. 01:38:01.850 --> 01:38:04.350 I haven't done research in like basically at all. 01:38:04.350 --> 01:38:05.930 I just, I've been like frustrated 01:38:05.930 --> 01:38:07.970 that we haven't switched for quite a while. 01:38:07.970 --> 01:38:11.470 And then this article came out and I was like, we're moving. 01:38:11.470 --> 01:38:12.890 It's like, I'm gonna find a way. 01:38:12.890 --> 01:38:13.730 I'm gonna get it done. 01:38:13.730 --> 01:38:14.550 We're moving. 01:38:14.550 --> 01:38:15.430 We have to move. 01:38:15.430 --> 01:38:16.730 But anyways, yeah. 01:38:16.730 --> 01:38:18.550 Previously mentioned breach in August. 01:38:18.550 --> 01:38:20.930 LastPass mentioned encrypted data was downloaded, 01:38:20.930 --> 01:38:22.050 but still secure. 01:38:22.050 --> 01:38:24.350 However, this recent update states that the breach was worse. 01:38:24.350 --> 01:38:26.890 Than expected as actors can brute force, 01:38:26.890 --> 01:38:30.470 decrypt the copied backup vaults that were removed 01:38:30.470 --> 01:38:33.270 out of their LastPass secured cloud containers. 01:38:33.270 --> 01:38:36.270 LastPass is advertising users to, sorry, 01:38:36.270 --> 01:38:39.350 advising users to reset and update all passwords, 01:38:39.350 --> 01:38:41.190 especially the master password. 01:38:42.550 --> 01:38:44.350 This is not exactly. 01:38:44.350 --> 01:38:48.390 The worst part is that there's information 01:38:48.390 --> 01:38:51.050 that is stored in plain text. 01:38:51.050 --> 01:38:51.890 Yeah. 01:38:51.890 --> 01:38:52.730 So this is- 01:38:52.730 --> 01:38:53.770 Usernames and passwords. 01:38:53.770 --> 01:38:54.110 Not so much. 01:38:54.110 --> 01:38:55.230 Not so much. 01:38:55.230 --> 01:39:00.230 But the, as far as I can tell the main account information. 01:39:00.730 --> 01:39:05.730 So the name, email address is accessible to the hackers 01:39:06.350 --> 01:39:08.190 and the URLs. 01:39:08.190 --> 01:39:09.110 Yes, the URLs. 01:39:09.110 --> 01:39:10.690 Were stored in plain text. 01:39:10.690 --> 01:39:11.860 Yep. 01:39:11.860 --> 01:39:16.660 So what that does is it makes the process of going through 01:39:16.660 --> 01:39:19.820 and trying to brute force the username and password 01:39:19.820 --> 01:39:23.660 much easier if you know what service it's for. 01:39:23.660 --> 01:39:25.280 So that's one thing. 01:39:25.280 --> 01:39:31.280 And number two is the entire web history of a user 01:39:31.280 --> 01:39:36.280 is pretty valuable, even without the usernames and passwords. 01:39:36.280 --> 01:39:39.700 And you would have it because they're tied. 01:39:39.700 --> 01:39:41.160 It's not the entire web history. 01:39:41.160 --> 01:39:44.160 Well, it's everywhere you have an account. 01:39:44.160 --> 01:39:45.000 Yeah. 01:39:45.000 --> 01:39:46.540 It's very similar, but not the same. 01:39:46.540 --> 01:39:47.700 I'm just saying. 01:39:47.700 --> 01:39:48.540 Sure. 01:39:48.540 --> 01:39:49.580 I'm just saying. 01:39:49.580 --> 01:39:51.580 But yeah, it's, I mean, this is horrible. 01:39:51.580 --> 01:39:55.050 Yeah. 01:39:55.050 --> 01:39:57.170 I'm just going to get out in front of it. 01:39:57.170 --> 01:40:00.090 I look at some bad stuff on the internet. 01:40:00.090 --> 01:40:01.030 Sure. 01:40:01.030 --> 01:40:03.290 Mine leaks, whatever, there's stuff in there. 01:40:06.290 --> 01:40:07.130 Yeah. 01:40:07.130 --> 01:40:10.130 And like one of the things too, is like people can say 01:40:10.130 --> 01:40:12.050 like these master passwords are going to be basically 01:40:12.050 --> 01:40:13.950 impossible to brute force. 01:40:13.950 --> 01:40:16.490 It's a non-zero possibility. 01:40:16.490 --> 01:40:19.750 And like compute, it's going like this. 01:40:19.750 --> 01:40:20.590 Yep. 01:40:20.590 --> 01:40:23.410 And people can find ways to break certain types 01:40:23.410 --> 01:40:25.290 of encryption and all this other type of stuff. 01:40:25.290 --> 01:40:29.830 So you should update all of your passwords 01:40:29.830 --> 01:40:34.090 and that's gonna suck, but you should do it anyways. 01:40:34.090 --> 01:40:36.260 And you should leave LastPass. 01:40:36.260 --> 01:40:38.500 That would be my suggestion. 01:40:38.500 --> 01:40:39.340 Yeah. 01:40:39.340 --> 01:40:40.160 Yep. 01:40:40.160 --> 01:40:43.330 So we need to update all of our passwords. 01:40:43.330 --> 01:40:44.170 Yep. 01:40:44.170 --> 01:40:45.010 And we need to leave LastPass. 01:40:45.010 --> 01:40:47.010 Especially our passwords for celebrityfeetpics.com. 01:40:47.010 --> 01:40:47.830 Yeah. 01:40:47.830 --> 01:40:48.670 Do you got that one? 01:40:48.670 --> 01:40:49.630 I don't even know if that's a real site. 01:40:49.630 --> 01:40:50.470 It probably is. 01:40:50.470 --> 01:40:51.290 I think, I think. 01:40:51.290 --> 01:40:52.470 It has to be. 01:40:52.470 --> 01:40:55.290 Isn't, there's some, there's some website that does that. 01:40:55.290 --> 01:40:56.130 I don't know if it's called that. 01:40:56.130 --> 01:40:57.550 Oh, I'm sure there is. 01:40:57.550 --> 01:41:00.540 This particular one isn't it. 01:41:00.540 --> 01:41:01.380 Nope. 01:41:01.380 --> 01:41:03.800 It's, it's this at the moment. 01:41:03.800 --> 01:41:04.620 Oh. 01:41:04.620 --> 01:41:05.460 So it seems to be parked. 01:41:05.460 --> 01:41:06.300 Yeah, it's parked. 01:41:06.300 --> 01:41:07.720 There's, there's something like that though. 01:41:07.720 --> 01:41:08.540 Oh, I'm sure there is. 01:41:08.540 --> 01:41:09.840 Cause I remember like forever ago, 01:41:09.840 --> 01:41:12.440 you were on there or something. 01:41:12.440 --> 01:41:13.280 On where? 01:41:13.280 --> 01:41:14.620 I think we like joked about it. 01:41:14.620 --> 01:41:18.020 You were on some website that like tracks celebrity feet 01:41:18.020 --> 01:41:18.940 pics. 01:41:18.940 --> 01:41:19.780 Shut up. 01:41:19.780 --> 01:41:21.080 I guarantee this is a thing. 01:41:24.100 --> 01:41:26.140 I did not think this was going to be something we were going 01:41:26.140 --> 01:41:27.480 to be looking up on WAN Show today. 01:41:27.600 --> 01:41:30.180 Um, but I like. 01:41:30.180 --> 01:41:31.600 Men.wikifeet? 01:41:31.600 --> 01:41:32.360 Wikifeet. 01:41:32.360 --> 01:41:34.540 Yeah. 01:41:34.540 --> 01:41:35.380 Hmm. 01:41:35.380 --> 01:41:36.820 Interesting. 01:41:36.820 --> 01:41:37.640 Yep. 01:41:37.640 --> 01:41:38.480 Is that you? 01:41:38.480 --> 01:41:39.670 I mean, this is. 01:41:39.670 --> 01:41:40.510 Yeah. 01:41:40.510 --> 01:41:41.350 This almost certainly is. 01:41:41.350 --> 01:41:42.470 This is. 01:41:42.470 --> 01:41:44.590 I'm pretty sure this is. 01:41:44.590 --> 01:41:45.430 Yep. 01:41:45.430 --> 01:41:47.130 This is my old bathroom scale. 01:41:47.130 --> 01:41:48.670 That's definitely my towel. 01:41:48.670 --> 01:41:49.510 Yeah. 01:41:49.510 --> 01:41:50.960 Huh. 01:41:50.960 --> 01:41:51.800 That's weird. 01:41:51.800 --> 01:41:52.640 Oh, you might want to close the page. 01:41:52.640 --> 01:41:53.460 I think there was something. 01:41:53.460 --> 01:41:54.300 No, no, no, no. 01:41:54.300 --> 01:41:55.100 Close it. 01:41:55.100 --> 01:41:55.920 Just close the page. 01:41:55.920 --> 01:41:58.230 Just close the page. 01:41:58.230 --> 01:41:59.070 Okay. 01:41:59.070 --> 01:41:59.890 I see. 01:41:59.890 --> 01:42:00.730 Yeah. 01:42:00.730 --> 01:42:03.110 Nope. 01:42:03.110 --> 01:42:03.930 Anywho. 01:42:03.930 --> 01:42:04.770 It is what it is. 01:42:10.020 --> 01:42:13.760 A UK regulator warns that sharing Netflix passwords 01:42:13.760 --> 01:42:16.100 may be illegal. 01:42:16.100 --> 01:42:16.940 Oh. 01:42:16.940 --> 01:42:21.020 UK's Intellectual Property Office said on Tuesday 01:42:21.020 --> 01:42:23.600 that sharing passwords to access content 01:42:23.600 --> 01:42:25.440 breaks copyright law. 01:42:26.360 --> 01:42:28.320 The comment was seemingly unsolicited 01:42:28.320 --> 01:42:30.820 as Netflix has never stated that it would take legal action 01:42:30.820 --> 01:42:31.820 against British people 01:42:31.820 --> 01:42:35.620 for sharing passwords, which is jolly good of them, I suppose. 01:42:35.620 --> 01:42:37.320 And since making the comment, 01:42:37.320 --> 01:42:39.940 the IPO has removed references to password sharing 01:42:39.940 --> 01:42:41.740 from the guidance portion of their website, 01:42:41.740 --> 01:42:44.520 but a spokesperson confirmed the agency's stance 01:42:44.520 --> 01:42:46.940 on the matter, saying there are a range of provisions 01:42:46.940 --> 01:42:49.200 in criminal and civil law, which may be applicable 01:42:49.200 --> 01:42:50.860 in the case of password sharing, 01:42:50.860 --> 01:42:52.240 where the intent is to allow a user 01:42:52.240 --> 01:42:55.580 to access copyright protected works without payment. 01:42:55.580 --> 01:42:57.580 TLDR, sharing a password is illegal 01:42:57.580 --> 01:42:59.280 in both a criminal and civil sense, 01:42:59.280 --> 01:43:00.700 according to this particular. 01:43:00.700 --> 01:43:01.700 It's okay. 01:43:01.700 --> 01:43:02.540 Sorry, I'm gonna. 01:43:02.540 --> 01:43:03.360 Body. 01:43:03.360 --> 01:43:04.200 I'm gonna interject for a second. 01:43:04.200 --> 01:43:05.040 What now? 01:43:05.040 --> 01:43:07.040 People pointed out that you didn't notice 01:43:07.040 --> 01:43:09.400 that was a problem because you don't see ads. 01:43:15.220 --> 01:43:16.960 It's true though. 01:43:16.960 --> 01:43:18.120 It just happened. 01:43:18.120 --> 01:43:19.040 We weren't kidding. 01:43:19.040 --> 01:43:20.420 It's actually a thing. 01:43:26.060 --> 01:43:28.520 Oh, I find that so funny. 01:43:28.520 --> 01:43:32.060 Remember those, remember those ads 01:43:32.060 --> 01:43:34.780 that would have like a super attractive, 01:43:34.780 --> 01:43:37.480 attractive woman, and then it would be like, 01:43:37.480 --> 01:43:40.160 by the way, there's a car in the picture or whatever. 01:43:40.160 --> 01:43:41.360 Oh yeah, sure. 01:43:41.360 --> 01:43:44.320 That's super like cringe style of ad. 01:43:44.320 --> 01:43:45.240 Yeah. 01:43:45.240 --> 01:43:46.120 You just see the car. 01:43:46.120 --> 01:43:47.120 Well, no, I just didn't see anything. 01:43:47.120 --> 01:43:48.160 You wouldn't see anything. 01:43:49.980 --> 01:43:51.200 Okay. 01:43:51.200 --> 01:43:52.900 Did you see the delay? 01:43:52.900 --> 01:43:55.620 How long it took for me to find a pair of breasts 01:43:55.620 --> 01:43:56.620 on a webpage? 01:43:59.200 --> 01:44:00.160 Doesn't see the ad. 01:44:00.160 --> 01:44:01.700 I can't see it. 01:44:01.700 --> 01:44:03.900 It doesn't matter what's on the ad. 01:44:03.900 --> 01:44:07.820 If it's an ad, I can't see it. 01:44:07.820 --> 01:44:09.200 It's invisible to me. 01:44:09.200 --> 01:44:13.600 We try, I'm so happy that we now have like really good proof 01:44:13.600 --> 01:44:15.100 because like, I know it's a thing, 01:44:15.100 --> 01:44:16.740 but when you try to tell people, 01:44:16.740 --> 01:44:18.320 I think a lot of people are like, oh yeah, sure. 01:44:18.320 --> 01:44:19.140 Whatever. 01:44:19.140 --> 01:44:21.560 Like, I don't, I'm not affected by ads. 01:44:21.560 --> 01:44:23.480 No, he doesn't see them. 01:44:23.480 --> 01:44:24.600 It's different. 01:44:24.600 --> 01:44:28.140 Like it's actually fundamentally different. 01:44:30.010 --> 01:44:31.630 So it was like, Linus is ad block. 01:44:31.630 --> 01:44:32.690 Yeah. 01:44:32.690 --> 01:44:33.850 I can get annoyed by them. 01:44:33.850 --> 01:44:36.730 Like the video we were shooting earlier 01:44:36.730 --> 01:44:37.810 with the worst videos, 01:44:37.810 --> 01:44:40.090 we were logged into the Linus Tech Tips, 01:44:40.090 --> 01:44:42.930 Google ads, Google account. 01:44:42.930 --> 01:44:43.770 Yeah. 01:44:43.770 --> 01:44:45.470 Because that's the only way for us to see 01:44:45.470 --> 01:44:47.010 the true like dislike ratio, 01:44:47.010 --> 01:44:49.390 which kind of helps when we're watching the content 01:44:49.390 --> 01:44:51.610 and trying to figure out what was so bad about it, right? 01:44:51.610 --> 01:44:53.770 And we don't have premium on that account. 01:44:53.770 --> 01:44:56.510 And I was annoyed by waiting 01:44:56.510 --> 01:44:58.390 to watch the video I want to watch, 01:44:58.390 --> 01:45:02.310 but I couldn't tell you a single thing we saw an ad for. 01:45:02.310 --> 01:45:03.650 Not a single one. 01:45:03.650 --> 01:45:05.310 I have no idea. 01:45:05.310 --> 01:45:08.890 All I really remember was registering because I, 01:45:08.890 --> 01:45:10.810 we've talked about this before, I have a premium account. 01:45:10.810 --> 01:45:12.810 All I remember was registering that there was like, 01:45:12.810 --> 01:45:14.650 we had to wait eight seconds for the current one 01:45:14.650 --> 01:45:15.850 and there was another one coming. 01:45:15.850 --> 01:45:17.730 And I was like, oh my goodness, this is crazy. 01:45:17.730 --> 01:45:19.070 But I don't remember what the ads were. 01:45:19.070 --> 01:45:21.230 That's because all I'm looking at is that timer 01:45:21.230 --> 01:45:22.530 for when I can click skip. 01:45:22.530 --> 01:45:23.350 Yeah. 01:45:23.350 --> 01:45:24.610 That's literally the only thing interesting. 01:45:24.610 --> 01:45:26.150 Becomes like a reaction timing game. 01:45:26.150 --> 01:45:28.110 As soon as I realized I can't skip it, 01:45:28.110 --> 01:45:30.350 my attention is somewhere else. 01:45:30.350 --> 01:45:32.270 It sure as heck isn't on my computer. 01:45:32.270 --> 01:45:34.150 Yeah. Yeah. 01:45:34.190 --> 01:45:35.030 But yeah, sorry. 01:45:35.030 --> 01:45:37.190 That was just, that was really funny. 01:45:37.190 --> 01:45:40.570 Anywho, despite no streaming service ever, 01:45:40.570 --> 01:45:42.270 so much as hinting at pursuing legal action 01:45:42.270 --> 01:45:43.730 against password sharers, 01:45:45.450 --> 01:45:49.210 CPS, the Crown Prosecution Service, 01:45:49.210 --> 01:45:50.570 has not ruled out the possibility 01:45:50.570 --> 01:45:52.610 of it seeking criminal charges against people 01:45:52.610 --> 01:45:55.610 that privateer password from their friends and loved ones. 01:45:55.610 --> 01:45:56.950 That's gotta be wild. 01:45:56.950 --> 01:46:00.290 Oh, they would need to have the case referred to them. 01:46:00.290 --> 01:46:01.330 So one of the streaming services 01:46:01.330 --> 01:46:04.230 would have to pursue legal action. 01:46:04.230 --> 01:46:04.950 Interesting. 01:46:04.990 --> 01:46:06.650 I mean, I don't think this is gonna happen. 01:46:06.650 --> 01:46:07.650 To put this in perspective, 01:46:07.650 --> 01:46:10.610 torrenting could carry a sentence of up to 10 years. 01:46:10.610 --> 01:46:12.690 It was raised from two years in 2017 01:46:12.690 --> 01:46:14.450 on the recommendation of the IPO. 01:46:14.450 --> 01:46:16.650 However, most prison sentences for piracy 01:46:16.650 --> 01:46:19.570 have been for those running torrent sites or live streams. 01:46:20.610 --> 01:46:21.690 Here's our discussion question. 01:46:21.690 --> 01:46:22.530 Oh boy. 01:46:22.530 --> 01:46:23.870 If Floatgain were to pursue legal action 01:46:23.870 --> 01:46:25.910 against someone for sharing a password, 01:46:25.910 --> 01:46:28.410 what would you anticipate the fallout to be like? 01:46:28.410 --> 01:46:29.250 Terrible. 01:46:29.250 --> 01:46:32.070 We have never considered pursuing legal action for that. 01:46:32.070 --> 01:46:34.790 We actually have some stuff that kind of tracks it. 01:46:34.990 --> 01:46:35.830 Really? 01:46:35.830 --> 01:46:36.650 I didn't even know. 01:46:36.650 --> 01:46:37.950 I know of a couple accounts 01:46:37.950 --> 01:46:40.450 that like are almost certainly doing that. 01:46:40.450 --> 01:46:42.370 We have banned an account for doing it, 01:46:42.370 --> 01:46:45.230 at least one account for doing it on like a mass scale. 01:46:45.230 --> 01:46:46.070 I know about that. 01:46:46.070 --> 01:46:50.830 But when we think it's probably a situation, 01:46:50.830 --> 01:46:53.370 like I ran into one where I actually ended up 01:46:53.370 --> 01:46:54.230 talking to them about it. 01:46:54.230 --> 01:46:57.190 This was like a few years ago when I used to stream. 01:46:57.190 --> 01:46:58.690 But they came into my stream and I was like, 01:46:58.690 --> 01:47:00.530 oh, it's you, you have the same username. 01:47:00.530 --> 01:47:01.950 And I just asked them about it. 01:47:01.950 --> 01:47:02.990 And it was like, it was on one IP for like, a second. 01:47:02.990 --> 01:47:03.990 And it was like, it was on one IP for like, a second. 01:47:03.990 --> 01:47:04.950 And it was like, it was on one IP for like, a second. 01:47:04.990 --> 01:47:05.830 And it was like, it was on one IP for like, a second. 01:47:05.830 --> 01:47:06.650 And it was like, it was on one IP for like, a second. 01:47:06.650 --> 01:47:07.490 And then it was on two IPs. 01:47:07.490 --> 01:47:08.330 And then it was on two IPs. 01:47:08.330 --> 01:47:09.150 And it was on two IPs. 01:47:09.150 --> 01:47:09.990 Yeah. 01:47:09.990 --> 01:47:10.830 And it's like, huh? 01:47:10.830 --> 01:47:11.910 And they were like, yeah, I mean, 01:47:11.910 --> 01:47:14.370 my brother and I shared an account when we lived together. 01:47:14.370 --> 01:47:15.990 And then I don't remember the exact details, 01:47:15.990 --> 01:47:17.030 but it was something along the lines of like, 01:47:17.030 --> 01:47:18.230 I went to university or whatever, 01:47:18.230 --> 01:47:19.370 we both still use the account. 01:47:19.370 --> 01:47:20.910 And I'm like, cool. 01:47:20.910 --> 01:47:22.370 I was half expecting it to be, 01:47:22.370 --> 01:47:25.330 I was half expecting it to be my parents divorced. 01:47:25.330 --> 01:47:28.150 Oh, well, no, okay, the thing that we were seeing 01:47:28.150 --> 01:47:30.110 was it being used at the same time. 01:47:30.110 --> 01:47:31.650 Right, okay, sure, sure, sure. 01:47:31.650 --> 01:47:33.410 So like- 01:47:33.410 --> 01:47:35.150 And my parents watched the land show. 01:47:36.860 --> 01:47:39.040 But yeah, like, I don't care about that. 01:47:39.040 --> 01:47:42.040 I don't, I'm not encouraging people to do this, 01:47:42.040 --> 01:47:45.200 but like, if it's within reason, I don't- 01:47:45.200 --> 01:47:47.400 I don't think we've ever really taken a stance on it. 01:47:47.400 --> 01:47:49.660 Yeah, the problem is when you post like, 01:47:49.660 --> 01:47:51.780 your username and login on some forum 01:47:51.780 --> 01:47:53.020 and you're like, how about it, God? 01:47:53.020 --> 01:47:55.200 Like, that's when it becomes an issue, 01:47:55.200 --> 01:47:56.120 if you're sharing it with- 01:47:56.120 --> 01:47:59.320 Or if you're using your account to download the material 01:47:59.320 --> 01:48:01.440 and then redistributing it, then obviously- 01:48:01.440 --> 01:48:01.740 Yeah, there's- 01:48:01.740 --> 01:48:04.900 There's issues there, but as long as you're not like, 01:48:04.900 --> 01:48:08.040 really abusing it, like, we don't really care. 01:48:08.040 --> 01:48:10.200 What if Flowplane was 300 times the size? 01:48:10.200 --> 01:48:13.080 I mean, I'm sure we would see it the same way as we do now, 01:48:13.080 --> 01:48:14.400 to be completely honest. 01:48:15.820 --> 01:48:17.820 We would be not happy with people 01:48:17.820 --> 01:48:19.320 that were mass sharing it, 01:48:21.200 --> 01:48:24.360 but in the way that I think a lot of Netflix accounts 01:48:24.360 --> 01:48:25.700 were shared back in the day, 01:48:25.700 --> 01:48:27.380 I think it would kind of be fine. 01:48:29.840 --> 01:48:32.580 I don't know, yeah. 01:48:32.580 --> 01:48:33.580 We should do some merch messages. 01:48:33.580 --> 01:48:34.780 Yeah. 01:48:34.780 --> 01:48:36.780 Because those we definitely, 01:48:36.780 --> 01:48:38.700 those definitely help us survive. 01:48:38.700 --> 01:48:40.060 Yeah. 01:48:40.060 --> 01:48:41.900 All right, hit us, Dan. 01:48:41.900 --> 01:48:42.740 Okay, I've got one here from- 01:48:42.740 --> 01:48:44.100 You're up. 01:48:44.100 --> 01:48:46.520 Hey, Linus and Luke, and behind the scenes people, 01:48:46.520 --> 01:48:47.980 liking the spooky WAN Show. 01:48:47.980 --> 01:48:50.400 Yeah, should we go spooky for the rest of merch messages? 01:48:50.400 --> 01:48:51.240 Okay, sure. 01:48:51.240 --> 01:48:52.060 I'm down, let's do it, I'll do it. 01:48:52.060 --> 01:48:53.860 No, no, you got it, you got your thing, you got your thing. 01:48:53.860 --> 01:48:55.980 Okay, wanted to ask Linus 01:48:55.980 --> 01:48:58.360 when the Secret Shopper Part Three is coming. 01:48:58.360 --> 01:48:59.440 Oh, okay. Been waiting for a while. 01:48:59.440 --> 01:49:00.940 So I wanted to interject on this one, 01:49:00.940 --> 01:49:02.520 and I actually wanted to answer this one, 01:49:02.520 --> 01:49:03.740 although he's probably gonna say this, too. 01:49:03.740 --> 01:49:05.160 He's probably gonna say the same thing. 01:49:05.160 --> 01:49:08.260 The whole point is that we can't tell you, 01:49:08.260 --> 01:49:10.360 because the, and I wanted to make sure I said that 01:49:10.360 --> 01:49:11.760 before he potentially says something else. 01:49:11.760 --> 01:49:12.600 Okay, yeah, yeah. 01:49:12.600 --> 01:49:14.600 Because the companies can't know it's coming. 01:49:14.600 --> 01:49:15.440 Yep. 01:49:15.440 --> 01:49:16.260 So- 01:49:16.260 --> 01:49:17.680 Has to be, boom, out of nowhere. 01:49:17.680 --> 01:49:18.520 Yep. 01:49:18.520 --> 01:49:20.300 You never expect the Spanish Inquisition. 01:49:20.300 --> 01:49:23.140 Yeah, so sorry, but no. 01:49:23.140 --> 01:49:25.100 Yeah, there will be another one. 01:49:25.100 --> 01:49:26.560 It might be happening now. 01:49:26.560 --> 01:49:28.360 It might be happening in a couple of years. 01:49:28.360 --> 01:49:29.680 It might've happened already. 01:49:29.680 --> 01:49:30.520 Who knows? 01:49:30.520 --> 01:49:31.560 We might've filmed it all already. 01:49:31.560 --> 01:49:32.860 Can't tell you anything, I'm sorry. 01:49:32.860 --> 01:49:34.460 Yeah. 01:49:34.580 --> 01:49:35.740 Are you a mole? 01:49:35.740 --> 01:49:37.280 Who do you work for? 01:49:37.280 --> 01:49:38.880 Is it iBUYPOWER? 01:49:38.880 --> 01:49:39.700 Is it Maingear? 01:49:39.700 --> 01:49:40.780 Is it Dell? 01:49:40.780 --> 01:49:42.440 Tell me! 01:49:42.440 --> 01:49:43.280 No, it's not Dell. 01:49:43.280 --> 01:49:44.100 Dell doesn't care. 01:49:46.100 --> 01:49:47.460 All right, I got another one here from Tom. 01:49:47.460 --> 01:49:48.300 Hi, guys. 01:49:48.300 --> 01:49:50.880 Do you think overclocking is slowly fading away 01:49:50.880 --> 01:49:53.640 now that CPUs and GPUs are already pushing the limits? 01:49:53.640 --> 01:49:54.460 Yes. 01:49:54.460 --> 01:49:55.300 Yes. 01:49:55.300 --> 01:49:56.140 Easy, quick. 01:49:56.140 --> 01:49:57.140 Got another one here from Jake. 01:49:57.140 --> 01:49:57.960 Hi, Linus. 01:49:57.960 --> 01:49:59.260 Do you seem to enjoy making some videos 01:49:59.260 --> 01:50:00.420 a lot more than others, 01:50:00.420 --> 01:50:03.140 like the recent chat GPT PC build? 01:50:03.140 --> 01:50:04.180 Do you ever wish you could do 01:50:04.180 --> 01:50:05.000 I've missed that. 01:50:05.000 --> 01:50:06.200 session project videos? 01:50:06.200 --> 01:50:09.420 And do you, would you need a smaller channel slash team 01:50:09.420 --> 01:50:10.540 to be able to do so? 01:50:10.540 --> 01:50:12.240 Merry Christmas all. 01:50:12.240 --> 01:50:14.420 I mean, you're already seeing that, 01:50:14.420 --> 01:50:16.460 you're already seeing that process playing out, right? 01:50:16.460 --> 01:50:18.500 Like that's where the smaller channels 01:50:18.500 --> 01:50:19.800 like ShortCircuit are coming from. 01:50:19.800 --> 01:50:21.500 ShortCircuit's a way for us to cover products 01:50:21.500 --> 01:50:23.800 that just wouldn't get enough eyeballs on them 01:50:23.800 --> 01:50:25.460 to justify uploading to LTT 01:50:25.460 --> 01:50:27.340 because it would just harm the channel. 01:50:27.340 --> 01:50:29.380 And you're gonna see a lot more of it. 01:50:29.380 --> 01:50:32.760 I think you can expect to see more niche channels 01:50:32.760 --> 01:50:34.960 as the lab team builds out their testing 01:50:34.960 --> 01:50:36.660 capabilities and we have all this data 01:50:36.660 --> 01:50:38.340 and we need to publish it somehow, right? 01:50:38.340 --> 01:50:39.160 Yeah. 01:50:39.160 --> 01:50:40.880 In text is great, but it doesn't make any money. 01:50:40.880 --> 01:50:43.420 So obviously we're gonna continue to do what we do best, 01:50:43.420 --> 01:50:45.040 which is create video content. 01:50:46.090 --> 01:50:50.390 So yeah, you're gonna see that a lot going forward. 01:50:50.390 --> 01:50:52.430 Now, with all of that said, 01:50:52.430 --> 01:50:55.460 I think you might be getting a, 01:50:55.460 --> 01:51:00.260 I may, I think sometimes people can get the wrong vibe 01:51:00.260 --> 01:51:02.380 just because I take on, for example, 01:51:02.380 --> 01:51:05.100 a more serious tone in a video doesn't mean I'm having, you know, a more serious tone in a video doesn't mean I'm having, you know, a more serious tone in a video doesn't mean I'm having, you know, a more serious tone in a video doesn't mean I'm having, you know, 01:51:05.100 --> 01:51:07.180 less fun in the creation process 01:51:07.180 --> 01:51:08.720 or that I don't think it's more important 01:51:08.720 --> 01:51:10.300 or that I don't think it's as important. 01:51:10.300 --> 01:51:12.520 Sometimes I think it's more important, 01:51:12.520 --> 01:51:15.180 but you also can't have the same amount of fun 01:51:15.180 --> 01:51:16.440 in everything you do. 01:51:16.440 --> 01:51:19.400 So like if we were to go through the last few videos, 01:51:19.400 --> 01:51:23.760 yeah, this doing everything the chat bot says was a blast 01:51:23.760 --> 01:51:26.400 because I'm super, super into this technology. 01:51:26.400 --> 01:51:28.560 And a lot of the time, you know, 01:51:28.560 --> 01:51:30.100 when we come up with a video concept, 01:51:30.100 --> 01:51:33.100 the whole reason that we're doing it 01:51:33.100 --> 01:51:35.100 is because it's something I want to talk 01:51:35.100 --> 01:51:38.060 about and then we just need kind of a vehicle for that. 01:51:38.060 --> 01:51:40.100 So building a computer was just an excuse 01:51:40.100 --> 01:51:43.220 to talk about chat GPT in a mainline video. 01:51:43.220 --> 01:51:44.520 This one I had a blast with. 01:51:44.520 --> 01:51:46.720 I mean, Jeff and I have never really gotten a chance 01:51:46.720 --> 01:51:50.600 to hang out outside of, you know, a few 01:51:50.600 --> 01:51:54.440 small encounters at like, you know, work events and stuff like that. 01:51:54.440 --> 01:51:56.720 And so I always enjoy Intel Extreme Tech Upgrade. 01:51:56.720 --> 01:51:58.340 And I think that comes through in the videos. 01:51:58.340 --> 01:52:01.440 People love Intel Extreme Tech Upgrade. 01:52:01.440 --> 01:52:03.300 This one was really stressful. 01:52:03.300 --> 01:52:05.100 It was a really fun idea. 01:52:05.100 --> 01:52:06.180 Like doing tech support. 01:52:06.180 --> 01:52:09.860 But some of the tools we ran into some challenges 01:52:09.860 --> 01:52:12.220 or rather the lines got flooded 01:52:12.220 --> 01:52:15.220 and handling a flooded support line is like never fun. 01:52:15.220 --> 01:52:17.300 So I think that did take a bit of the fun out of it. 01:52:17.300 --> 01:52:19.100 There were elements of it that were super fun, 01:52:19.100 --> 01:52:21.020 like Dr. Ian Cutress calling into the show. 01:52:21.020 --> 01:52:24.680 And just bloody guy rolling you with like a crazy question. 01:52:24.680 --> 01:52:27.220 Hey, I got it, though. I'm feeling good about that. 01:52:27.220 --> 01:52:28.480 It's pretty good. 01:52:29.480 --> 01:52:31.760 Sponsored stuff is always challenging, right? 01:52:31.760 --> 01:52:35.060 Like I said, everything that I wanted to say, 01:52:35.100 --> 01:52:39.020 but that back and forth, I'm so glad that I have a sales team 01:52:39.020 --> 01:52:40.980 that kind of deals with all of that for me now, 01:52:40.980 --> 01:52:43.940 where the brand will come and say, oh, we don't like the way you worded it. 01:52:43.940 --> 01:52:45.300 And I'll say too bad. 01:52:45.300 --> 01:52:49.480 And then our sales team gets to kind of play Messenger in between. 01:52:49.480 --> 01:52:51.180 But this is a super cool monitor. 01:52:51.180 --> 01:52:52.220 I had fun with that. 01:52:52.220 --> 01:52:54.560 The fake merch, always a lot of fun for me. 01:52:54.560 --> 01:52:57.860 Working with the Hacksmith team, total blast. 01:52:57.860 --> 01:53:01.600 Like there's nothing in here, this monitor, I was not that interested in. 01:53:01.600 --> 01:53:02.760 And then I actually used it. 01:53:02.760 --> 01:53:04.180 And all of a sudden I was like, whoa, this is super cool. 01:53:04.180 --> 01:53:12.700 Love, I mean, we don't really make a lot of videos 01:53:12.700 --> 01:53:16.080 about stuff that I'm not interested in. 01:53:16.080 --> 01:53:21.970 Because I hand select pretty much every topic. 01:53:21.970 --> 01:53:25.880 Not all, but very many. 01:53:25.880 --> 01:53:28.640 Is there anything, okay, I did not hand select for us 01:53:28.640 --> 01:53:33.750 to forget about Luke's portion of the part one of the art challenge. 01:53:33.750 --> 01:53:34.750 This I hand selected. 01:53:34.750 --> 01:53:36.590 This I hand selected. 01:53:36.590 --> 01:53:37.750 This I didn't hand select. 01:53:37.750 --> 01:53:38.910 This was pitched to me. 01:53:38.910 --> 01:53:43.210 Tanner pitched this, adding USB-C to old consoles. 01:53:43.210 --> 01:53:43.790 That was cool. 01:53:43.790 --> 01:53:47.250 But when he pitched it, initially I was like, uh-huh, and? 01:53:47.250 --> 01:53:49.910 And then when he explained it, I was like, whoa, that's so cool. 01:53:49.910 --> 01:53:52.300 And so, yeah, I'm super into it. 01:53:52.300 --> 01:53:52.840 You know what? 01:53:52.840 --> 01:53:56.000 I think what you might see in a video like this is that I didn't get to play 01:53:56.000 --> 01:53:58.000 around with it firsthand as much. 01:53:58.000 --> 01:54:02.080 If I'd gotten to really play with it, I think you might have seen a bit more 01:54:02.080 --> 01:54:04.100 animation on my side. 01:54:04.100 --> 01:54:04.600 Sometimes. 01:54:04.600 --> 01:54:08.840 Sometimes it's the end of the day, and I'm kind of tired, like I'm doing my best. 01:54:08.840 --> 01:54:13.980 But no matter how enthusiastic I am about something, I still do have to present. 01:54:13.980 --> 01:54:18.260 My job is not just as simple as being someone who's into this stuff and talking 01:54:18.260 --> 01:54:22.980 about it, and I wish it was, because it'd be a lot easier to hire people to help me 01:54:22.980 --> 01:54:24.100 with it. 01:54:24.100 --> 01:54:25.760 But Luke knows. 01:54:25.760 --> 01:54:28.140 I mean, it's not something people can just pick up overnight. 01:54:28.140 --> 01:54:28.900 Try it. 01:54:28.900 --> 01:54:29.940 Go make a video. 01:54:29.940 --> 01:54:30.940 It's really hard. 01:54:30.940 --> 01:54:32.840 Try to get views on YouTube. 01:54:32.840 --> 01:54:33.760 Yeah. 01:54:33.760 --> 01:54:38.380 It is a real job, and I'm glad that you almost never see that anymore. 01:54:38.380 --> 01:54:42.720 You know, well, if you want to make money, get a real job instead of being a YouTuber. 01:54:42.720 --> 01:54:43.880 It is a real job. 01:54:43.880 --> 01:54:45.180 It's not easy. 01:54:45.180 --> 01:54:47.710 Yeah. 01:54:47.710 --> 01:54:50.910 The mood lighting is a throwback to when the power went out earlier on the show, 01:54:50.910 --> 01:54:53.250 for those of you who are just joining us. 01:54:53.250 --> 01:54:55.280 What else you got for us, Dan? 01:54:55.280 --> 01:54:57.980 OK, I got one here from Jose. 01:54:57.980 --> 01:55:00.320 Oh, it's in, yeah, it's in Mexican. 01:55:00.320 --> 01:55:02.780 Saludos desde Mexico. 01:55:02.780 --> 01:55:03.860 I'm awful at this. 01:55:03.860 --> 01:55:04.860 I hope you have a great holiday. 01:55:04.860 --> 01:55:08.860 I would like to know how the dual audio project is going. 01:55:08.860 --> 01:55:11.520 Love your videos, but some friends don't speak English, 01:55:11.520 --> 01:55:15.620 so the dub would help a lot to show this amazing channel. 01:55:15.620 --> 01:55:17.000 Still in progress. 01:55:17.000 --> 01:55:20.340 I haven't gotten an update from Ed on it in the last little while, 01:55:20.340 --> 01:55:24.260 but we've been just kind of trying to push through the product releases and 01:55:24.260 --> 01:55:24.960 Q4 is a thing. 01:55:24.960 --> 01:55:29.920 Limited people availability due to weather, due to the time of year. 01:55:29.920 --> 01:55:34.880 That's been a backburner project compared to LTT videos must be shot. 01:55:34.920 --> 01:55:38.920 Because that's ultimately what pays the bills. 01:55:38.920 --> 01:55:41.920 So I wish I had an update for you, but I'm afraid that I don't for the moment. 01:55:41.920 --> 01:55:48.980 OK, I got another one here from Kevin. 01:55:48.980 --> 01:55:51.660 Can you test whether lifting a laptop by its palm rest causes... 01:55:51.660 --> 01:55:52.920 You answered this earlier, didn't you? 01:55:52.920 --> 01:55:53.920 Yes. 01:55:53.920 --> 01:55:54.920 I probably didn't deal with it properly. 01:55:54.920 --> 01:55:55.920 Cool idea. 01:55:55.920 --> 01:55:56.920 Anonymous. 01:55:56.920 --> 01:55:59.340 Hey, guys, I'm waiting to get into IT soon. 01:55:59.340 --> 01:56:03.220 And with the technical difficulties experienced tonight, I was wondering how help desk issues 01:56:03.220 --> 01:56:04.220 are solved at LMG. 01:56:04.220 --> 01:56:05.920 Oh, we did this one, too. 01:56:05.920 --> 01:56:06.920 OK, it's me. 01:56:06.920 --> 01:56:07.920 Did you do that? 01:56:07.920 --> 01:56:08.920 Yeah. 01:56:08.920 --> 01:56:10.150 Did you do this one? 01:56:10.150 --> 01:56:11.150 No. 01:56:11.150 --> 01:56:12.150 Colin, shout out from Korea. 01:56:12.150 --> 01:56:18.150 In VR benchmarks, there are different experiences based on hardware setups, and even minor hardware 01:56:18.150 --> 01:56:21.150 changes have significant implications. 01:56:21.150 --> 01:56:27.150 Given VR requires a human interaction, how would you try to objectively make a comparable 01:56:27.150 --> 01:56:28.150 VR benchmark? 01:56:28.150 --> 01:56:35.150 It's really challenging because the level of detail changes constantly and can change 01:56:35.150 --> 01:56:38.150 depending on, like you said, a human interaction with the headset. 01:56:38.150 --> 01:56:39.150 Or with the in-game environment. 01:56:39.150 --> 01:56:40.150 We do have an expert on staff now. 01:56:40.150 --> 01:56:41.150 I think he's actually in the chat. 01:56:41.150 --> 01:56:42.150 Jake, are you in the chat? 01:56:42.150 --> 01:56:43.150 Other, more different Jake, who has a lot of experience in machine vision from mobile 01:56:43.150 --> 01:56:44.150 benchmarking, which has a lot of the same challenges. 01:56:44.150 --> 01:56:45.150 And I think it's something that we're going to be able to solve in the long term, but 01:56:45.150 --> 01:56:46.150 it's going to take some time. 01:56:46.150 --> 01:56:47.150 OK. 01:56:47.150 --> 01:56:48.150 Got another one here from Jay. 01:56:48.150 --> 01:56:49.150 Hope Luke's house gets fixed quickly. 01:56:49.150 --> 01:56:50.150 Me, too. 01:56:50.150 --> 01:56:51.150 Do you think we'll ever start seeing a new house? 01:56:51.150 --> 01:56:52.150 No. 01:56:52.150 --> 01:56:53.150 No. 01:56:53.150 --> 01:56:54.150 No. 01:56:54.150 --> 01:56:55.150 No. 01:56:55.150 --> 01:56:56.150 No. 01:56:56.150 --> 01:56:57.150 No. 01:56:57.150 --> 01:56:58.150 No. 01:56:58.150 --> 01:56:59.150 No. 01:56:59.150 --> 01:57:00.150 No. 01:57:00.150 --> 01:57:01.150 No. 01:57:01.150 --> 01:57:04.640 No. 01:57:04.640 --> 01:57:05.640 No. 01:57:05.640 --> 01:57:06.640 No. 01:57:06.640 --> 01:57:07.640 No. 01:57:07.640 --> 01:57:08.640 No. 01:57:08.640 --> 01:57:09.640 No. 01:57:09.640 --> 01:57:10.640 No. 01:57:10.640 --> 01:57:11.640 No. 01:57:11.640 --> 01:57:12.640 No. 01:57:12.640 --> 01:57:13.640 No. 01:57:13.640 --> 01:57:14.640 No. 01:57:14.640 --> 01:57:15.640 No. 01:57:15.640 --> 01:57:16.640 No. 01:57:16.640 --> 01:57:17.640 No. 01:57:17.640 --> 01:57:18.640 No. 01:57:18.640 --> 01:57:19.640 No. 01:57:19.640 --> 01:57:20.640 No. 01:57:20.640 --> 01:57:21.640 No. 01:57:21.640 --> 01:57:22.640 No. 01:57:22.640 --> 01:57:23.640 No. 01:57:23.640 --> 01:57:24.640 No. 01:57:24.640 --> 01:57:25.640 No. 01:57:25.640 --> 01:57:26.640 No. 01:57:26.640 --> 01:57:27.640 No. 01:57:27.640 --> 01:57:28.640 No. 01:57:28.640 --> 01:57:29.640 No. 01:57:29.640 --> 01:57:30.640 No. 01:57:30.640 --> 01:57:31.640 No. 01:57:31.640 --> 01:57:32.640 No. 01:57:32.640 --> 01:57:33.640 No. 01:57:33.640 --> 01:57:34.640 No. 01:57:34.640 --> 01:57:35.640 No. 01:57:35.640 --> 01:57:36.640 No. 01:57:36.640 --> 01:57:37.640 No. 01:57:37.640 --> 01:57:38.640 No. 01:57:38.640 --> 01:57:39.640 No. 01:57:39.640 --> 01:57:48.660 I think rather than create like the the memory cost is not a huge amount compared to the overall 01:57:48.660 --> 01:57:55.200 bill of materials for our card over you know 250 300 which is almost all of them now so I don't 01:57:55.200 --> 01:58:02.300 think it is worthwhile for our company to create these different SKUs unless they think there's a 01:58:02.300 --> 01:58:10.200 very compelling competitive reason I think we've seen reactionary reactionary responses to a lower 01:58:10.200 --> 01:58:17.520 end competitor with less VRAM for example to keep costs under control but very rarely do we see not 01:58:17.520 --> 01:58:23.640 at least since the 900 series I think very rarely do no 10 series had a 3 gig and a 6 gig version 01:58:23.640 --> 01:58:28.420 of the 1060 if I recall correctly very rarely do we see NVIDIA go out of their way and AMD for that 01:58:28.420 --> 01:58:35.400 matter to have different VRAM versions of their cards lately and yeah my my guess is just that 01:58:35.400 --> 01:58:39.910 they don't want to support more versions of the SKU why have one that is 01:58:39.910 --> 01:58:40.310 effectively more effective than the 1060 and the 1060 and the 1060 and the 1060 and the 1060 and 01:58:40.310 --> 01:58:43.970 are effectively obsolete before the other one if it doesn't actually save that much on the bill of 01:58:43.970 --> 01:58:50.450 materials the 3080 had 10 and 12 but those were not quite exactly the same card if I recall correctly 01:58:50.450 --> 01:58:56.270 and again that different version kind of came along later it wasn't just yeah we've got an 8 gig 01:58:56.270 --> 01:59:00.110 and a 4 gig version of this card right out of the gate like I think the last one I can remember that 01:59:00.110 --> 01:59:06.530 was like that was the RX 480 I think just or 470 one of them I think just had a four and an 8 gig 01:59:06.530 --> 01:59:14.140 version don't quote me on that though okay got another one here from anonymous Linus 01:59:14.140 --> 01:59:19.180 Linus and Luke what would it take for me to get an LTT backpack signed by as many people on both 01:59:19.180 --> 01:59:25.820 teams as possible go to LTX go to LTX yeah that's why I curated that question yeah that's your only 01:59:25.820 --> 01:59:31.040 chance we literally don't even ship the products from this warehouse so how would I sign it yeah 01:59:31.040 --> 01:59:35.660 like I'm not in that I've been in that warehouse once yeah it's like actually not a thing but 01:59:37.040 --> 01:59:40.460 pretty much the whole team is going to be there I'm assuming I think a lot of people are I think 01:59:40.460 --> 01:59:43.880 it's one of those things where you don't have to be there but you better not miss it kind of things 01:59:44.300 --> 01:59:50.160 yeah kind of like the Christmas party yeah that one here from Nathan Merry Christmas LMG crew and 01:59:50.160 --> 01:59:55.740 families has a standoff tool or set of standoff bits ever been considered for the screwdriver 01:59:55.740 --> 02:00:00.360 found myself needing some when replacing a motherboard recently yeah it doesn't fit in 02:00:00.360 --> 02:00:05.580 the built-in bit holder so once we have yeah once we have a separate bit holding mechanism 02:00:05.580 --> 02:00:10.800 we will absolutely do some socketed bits totally makes sense matter of time this one's from David 02:00:10.800 --> 02:00:14.820 hey guys I've recently developed an addiction to buying 4K Blu-rays 02:00:14.880 --> 02:00:21.780 after throwing an LG OLED and svf speakers in my bedroom any favorite go-to movies for putting your 02:00:21.780 --> 02:00:28.460 home theater to the test so far mine's been Pacific Rim not the best writing but man does it I thought 02:00:28.460 --> 02:00:38.460 you might have a good answer oh yeah not really I just um there's some really cool scenes in that 02:00:38.460 --> 02:00:45.660 weird horror uh horror movie with the with the cult um man I can't remember what it's a lot 02:00:45.660 --> 02:00:47.920 of horror movies yeah but they've burned they burn a barn at the end I don't know if it's like it's a 02:00:48.240 --> 02:00:55.020 know anyway i'm not sure um this looks looks really great in HDR yeah 1917 is definitely a 02:00:55.020 --> 02:01:00.540 good one chats uh chats getting us some good ones i refuse to ever put the hobbit on any screen in 02:01:00.540 --> 02:01:10.320 my house good so that's cool oh no yeah midsummer that's the one uh blade runner 2049 not a great 02:01:10.320 --> 02:01:15.160 one just the way it's mastered um we found out kind of later after it like it looks really great 02:01:15.160 --> 02:01:21.500 but the way it's mastered doesn't really let um better HDR displays stretch their legs from my 02:01:21.500 --> 02:01:34.600 understanding so we've we've stopped using it um yeah lala land is really beautiful yeah the 02:01:34.600 --> 02:01:40.580 hurricane obviously you know since i own so many copies of it it's a whole thing i bought it on 02:01:40.580 --> 02:01:50.900 dvhs for a video recently wow yeah it's worth watching dvhs is a hell of a drug okay i got 02:01:50.900 --> 02:01:52.080 another one here what happened to the 02:01:52.100 --> 02:01:56.760 GPU shirt design will it ever come back what happened to all of our shirt designs 02:01:56.760 --> 02:02:05.260 right now we only have blank shirts i didn't know that yeah so our shirt printer our local 02:02:05.260 --> 02:02:14.520 screen printer got evicted from his space um and like i don't know at risk of talking publicly 02:02:14.520 --> 02:02:21.040 about you know dealings that have not been acknowledged publicly i'm just gonna say it 02:02:21.040 --> 02:02:21.760 um 02:02:22.480 --> 02:02:30.260 i don't understand uh the response that um our screen printer gave us when we basically said 02:02:30.260 --> 02:02:40.120 hey we've got lab one sitting empty why don't you lease from us and like we're some way over 02:02:40.120 --> 02:02:48.580 50 of your business anyway so you know why don't we why don't why don't we just we we don't want 02:02:48.580 --> 02:02:52.840 a disruption we don't have another source we don't want a disruption in your business you 02:02:53.480 --> 02:02:55.140 know what i'm saying you know we don't want a disruption in your business obviously you know 02:02:55.140 --> 02:02:58.660 we're gonna help take care of you because we don't want a disruption in your business 02:02:58.660 --> 02:03:02.460 we know it muddies the waters a little bit but it would be at just it would be at a market rate 02:03:02.460 --> 02:03:07.220 we're not looking to screw you over because we don't want any disruption to your business yeah 02:03:07.220 --> 02:03:12.140 um you know the way that i saw it it would be more beneficial we'd have been happy to sign 02:03:12.140 --> 02:03:18.060 a short-term lease uh just to make sure that there's no interruption to his business um 02:03:18.060 --> 02:03:23.340 and basically the response was like from my point of view from like a from like a 02:03:23.340 --> 02:03:28.340 a business planning standpoint i understand part of it you don't want to have too many eggs in one 02:03:28.340 --> 02:03:33.020 basket you know you don't want to have that one client that's most of your sales and also your 02:03:33.020 --> 02:03:41.130 landlord you know i like i get it but on the other hand your options are us or not running nothing 02:03:41.130 --> 02:03:46.290 your business right now you could do like a one-year lease and figure it out after and like 02:03:46.290 --> 02:03:52.330 we want to help you out um we've we've never done anything like evil to you so what makes you think 02:03:52.330 --> 02:03:58.850 we're going to start now um so from from just like uh it seemed like a very emotional response 02:03:58.850 --> 02:04:09.290 rather than a um uh a carefully considered response so i don't know uh we were looking 02:04:09.290 --> 02:04:14.250 for alternatives we found one that's actually run by one of the companies that we work with 02:04:14.250 --> 02:04:19.470 for overseas production but frankly and again no offense if you're watching this but the quality's 02:04:22.750 --> 02:04:26.730 so we need something that matches what we were using before in terms of the quality 02:04:26.730 --> 02:04:32.390 but we need we either need to find a new source for that or we need the person we've been working 02:04:32.390 --> 02:04:38.110 with to pull his or her head out of their butt and figure out how to like actually print some 02:04:38.110 --> 02:04:42.230 shirts instead of just like sitting and not printing shirts which is obviously not good 02:04:42.230 --> 02:04:48.990 for their business um the badger hound says bro come on this is hubris that's a perfectly valid 02:04:48.990 --> 02:04:52.350 reason you're just mad they said no well they should be mad they said no they are currently 02:04:53.290 --> 02:04:59.050 working together it's not just for us for anyone that's not good that's bad um and like i said i 02:04:59.050 --> 02:05:03.350 fully understand their discomfort which is why we were willing to offer a short-term lease nobody 02:05:03.350 --> 02:05:09.110 does that uh maybe in the market you're in that's the thing uh here you you don't sign a one-year 02:05:09.110 --> 02:05:13.970 commercial lease or anything like that less than what is it less than 0.1 i think commercial 02:05:13.970 --> 02:05:18.910 vacancy yeah but it's one of those things where if we're if we're working together well we're 02:05:18.910 --> 02:05:23.050 working together like you got to communicate you got to say look here are my concerns and we can do 02:05:23.050 --> 02:05:23.270 what we can do and we can do what we can do and we can do what we can do and we can do what we can 02:05:23.270 --> 02:05:27.670 to address it but if you're just going to kind of be irrational and just say no no i don't like it i 02:05:27.670 --> 02:05:32.870 don't like i don't like it okay whatever then then i guess you're not printing shirts which is pretty 02:05:32.870 --> 02:05:45.050 bad um oh next up yeah good luck with that got another one here from thomas hi Linus any update 02:05:45.050 --> 02:05:49.690 on the summertime jacket hearing your thoughts on dealing with the hassle of sunscreen had hit 02:05:49.690 --> 02:05:53.530 home for me would love to know if this is still happening or if it's just an idea 02:05:54.250 --> 02:05:56.650 oh still happening yeah it should be out for next summer 02:05:56.730 --> 02:06:01.370 uh the it's a great garment i absolutely love it i took it with me on my hawaii trip a little 02:06:01.370 --> 02:06:10.520 while ago and was just just pleased his punch pleased his punch okay we've got one here from 02:06:10.520 --> 02:06:16.940 seth i've been called petty what do you mean petty what are you talking about i'm telling you 02:06:17.500 --> 02:06:26.060 facts you cannot like facts we tried to help offer a solution and it wasn't taken and now 02:06:26.060 --> 02:06:30.620 it's really bad for everyone involved for everyone including the other person it's a 02:06:30.700 --> 02:06:37.880 lose-lose nobody won what's pretty about it there's a uncomfortable or a lose-lose 02:06:38.520 --> 02:06:41.640 yeah and the uncomfortable it's like yeah but you just got to like communicate it's 02:06:41.640 --> 02:06:45.320 like any relationship you can just shut down 02:06:48.200 --> 02:06:53.960 okay well then the relationship's over right or you work with people those are those are 02:06:53.960 --> 02:07:03.340 really your only two options okay this one's from seth LTT video idea right ways of power management 02:07:04.380 --> 02:07:10.540 tech ups surge protection went upgrade power to accommodate all the ltd talks about servers new 02:07:10.540 --> 02:07:17.260 gen gaming pcs um yeah i mean really that's something that we're not going to be able to 02:07:17.260 --> 02:07:21.660 cover in the kind of depth that we want to cover it until the psu tester is fully up and running 02:07:21.660 --> 02:07:25.420 and maybe we have like a second one because it's going to be an enormous volume of devices to push 02:07:25.420 --> 02:07:36.840 through it so in time in time okay i've got another one here from anonymous hey Linus i'm 02:07:36.840 --> 02:07:42.120 absolutely loving the screwdriver i often find myself fidgeting with it instead of my usual 02:07:42.120 --> 02:07:46.600 fidget toys and was wondering if you ever thought of making a high quality fidgets as i find a lot 02:07:46.600 --> 02:07:51.640 of them to be lower quality yes we are already planning a fidget toy using the exact same 02:07:51.640 --> 02:07:55.800 ratchet from the screwdriver it's not going to be cheap because it's a super expensive part 02:07:55.800 --> 02:08:00.040 but i'm not going to apologize for that because it's going to be the best darn fidget ratchet 02:08:00.040 --> 02:08:06.980 on the market that's all we hear all the time sorry not sorry just buy buy another 02:08:07.380 --> 02:08:13.700 driver yeah um this one's from jacob gift cards until i can get a backpack what is y'all's take 02:08:13.700 --> 02:08:19.540 on development teams releasing games in alpha stages to sell copies for cash flow and spending 02:08:19.540 --> 02:08:22.900 10 years without leaving alpha or just never finishing the game 02:08:24.900 --> 02:08:31.140 sorry um are you saying tarkov i don't know what you're talking about yeah tarkov's still in beta 02:08:31.140 --> 02:08:37.380 uh tarkov if i don't know if that's clue or sorry true if you google is tarkov still in 02:08:37.380 --> 02:08:43.060 beta it says it's enclosed beta i don't think it's enclosed i was able to buy a license for it fine 02:08:43.060 --> 02:08:46.980 just fine i don't think it's enclosed close to anyone who doesn't have a credit card and pays 02:08:46.980 --> 02:08:52.660 the money yeah yeah there you go um minecraft was another fairly notorious one minecraft was 02:08:52.660 --> 02:09:01.780 in beta for like an extremely long time um citizen star citizen yeah i i mean it's a 02:09:01.780 --> 02:09:06.260 it's a thing and it's uh it's kind of frustrating but i can also understand 02:09:07.380 --> 02:09:11.190 a lot of the reasons why if i had to be honest when we were starting out with this game 02:09:11.190 --> 02:09:14.890 um there's a couple of things that i can i was impressed with the game itself 02:09:14.890 --> 02:09:19.030 first and foremost because of the most pullback rate it has so i i'm going to say out of the 02:09:19.030 --> 02:09:23.830 way i don't know if you have a video game that has that kind of a pullback rate with arena i 02:09:23.830 --> 02:09:28.070 would say that arena has a pullback rate pretty large um for the development team woes especially 02:09:28.070 --> 02:09:34.310 from actually no pretty much only from indie development studios if you're a indie development 02:09:34.310 --> 02:09:38.070 studio you've got a few people on staff you have a certain um amount of time you could run for is that 02:09:38.070 --> 02:09:41.670 which I mean, is true if you sell enough copies 02:09:41.670 --> 02:09:43.150 to keep your company going 02:09:43.150 --> 02:09:47.230 and suddenly is immediately not true if you don't. 02:09:47.230 --> 02:09:48.730 Yeah, but then the flip side of that 02:09:48.730 --> 02:09:49.990 is if you don't sell any copies, 02:09:49.990 --> 02:09:51.810 then maybe it just never gets made at all. 02:09:51.810 --> 02:09:54.330 So if it's your only way, 02:09:54.330 --> 02:09:57.070 but then it feels like in some cases 02:09:57.070 --> 02:09:58.750 it might not have been the only way. 02:09:58.750 --> 02:10:00.930 Yeah, it can be a little bit gross, 02:10:00.930 --> 02:10:02.150 but I think it's just something 02:10:02.150 --> 02:10:03.650 we're gonna have to live with. 02:10:06.640 --> 02:10:07.480 Did we lose power again? 02:10:07.480 --> 02:10:08.320 We had a flash over. 02:10:08.320 --> 02:10:09.180 We had a flicker? 02:10:09.180 --> 02:10:10.020 Yeah. 02:10:10.020 --> 02:10:10.860 It was just a brown up. 02:10:10.860 --> 02:10:12.120 Oh, you can hear it. 02:10:12.120 --> 02:10:13.440 Well, we're almost done. 02:10:13.440 --> 02:10:14.280 All right, all right. 02:10:14.280 --> 02:10:16.100 But yeah, I think sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do 02:10:16.100 --> 02:10:18.600 and I think sometimes it's abused and that is what it is. 02:10:18.600 --> 02:10:21.520 Whoa, look at this. 02:10:21.520 --> 02:10:23.800 Now would be a good time to insert ads. 02:10:23.800 --> 02:10:25.520 There's a money button. 02:10:25.520 --> 02:10:27.440 There's a money button. 02:10:27.440 --> 02:10:29.220 Okay, hold on, let's do the math. 02:10:29.220 --> 02:10:32.780 There's 9,900 viewers on YouTube. 02:10:32.780 --> 02:10:35.400 Okay, hold on. 02:10:35.400 --> 02:10:37.060 Okay, so what is it? 02:10:37.060 --> 02:10:38.300 30 seconds for an ad. 02:10:38.300 --> 02:10:43.300 So 0.5 minutes times 9,900 equals... 02:10:45.520 --> 02:10:46.660 Okay, so hold on a second. 02:10:46.660 --> 02:10:47.500 What is this? 02:10:47.500 --> 02:10:50.360 Okay, this is 4,950 minutes. 02:10:50.360 --> 02:10:55.360 Okay, divided by 60 equals 82 hours, right? 02:10:55.760 --> 02:10:57.200 Am I doing this right so far? 02:10:57.200 --> 02:10:58.040 I think so, yeah. 02:10:58.040 --> 02:11:00.640 Okay, divided by 24. 02:11:00.640 --> 02:11:05.640 Okay, so it's 3.4 days, which is about 1% of a year. 02:11:07.120 --> 02:11:08.300 Okay, so now hold on a second. 02:11:08.300 --> 02:11:12.540 If we assume an average lifespan of about 75 years, 02:11:12.540 --> 02:11:16.160 then that would be, let's say, so 1% of a year, 02:11:16.160 --> 02:11:19.160 0.1% of 10 years, point... 02:11:19.160 --> 02:11:24.060 About, let's say about 0.01% of a human lifetime, okay? 02:11:24.060 --> 02:11:24.900 How much is that worth? 02:11:24.900 --> 02:11:27.480 So if every time I press this button, 02:11:27.480 --> 02:11:32.480 I killed 0.01% of a human, would I keep pressing this button? 02:11:34.420 --> 02:11:35.980 Let's get into it. 02:11:35.980 --> 02:11:37.080 Let's get into it. 02:11:38.300 --> 02:11:41.400 Let's talk moral and ethical dilemmas. 02:11:41.400 --> 02:11:42.520 Oh my goodness. 02:11:44.580 --> 02:11:47.740 If you could kill 0.01% of a human 02:11:47.740 --> 02:11:49.640 every time you pressed a button- 02:11:49.640 --> 02:11:50.480 How much would that be worth to you? 02:11:50.480 --> 02:11:53.300 And you never knew any of them except your mom, 02:11:53.300 --> 02:11:55.260 who watches The Land Show, 02:11:55.260 --> 02:11:57.040 would you keep pressing the button, Luke? 02:11:57.040 --> 02:11:59.180 Oh my goodness. 02:11:59.180 --> 02:12:04.080 That is a dark but somewhat accurate way to look at that. 02:12:04.080 --> 02:12:04.920 Yeah. 02:12:04.920 --> 02:12:05.760 As long as I carry the zero, 02:12:05.760 --> 02:12:07.460 yeah, I think it's a little bit less than that. 02:12:07.460 --> 02:12:08.340 As the channel grows. 02:12:08.340 --> 02:12:09.380 As the channel grows, man. 02:12:09.380 --> 02:12:11.940 I would look at the cumulative hours 02:12:11.940 --> 02:12:16.060 spent watching the content and I would do that math. 02:12:16.060 --> 02:12:17.820 Like this is in the very early days and I'd go, 02:12:17.820 --> 02:12:22.820 holy crap, LTT has consumed one lifetime. 02:12:22.880 --> 02:12:24.300 Now it's 10 lifetimes. 02:12:24.300 --> 02:12:25.880 Now it's a hundred lifetimes. 02:12:25.880 --> 02:12:26.720 And I'm- 02:12:26.720 --> 02:12:29.300 X amount of lifetimes, like a week or a day or whatever. 02:12:29.300 --> 02:12:33.040 It would make me think about the value of it, you know? 02:12:33.040 --> 02:12:33.880 Yeah. 02:12:33.880 --> 02:12:35.760 Are we putting, are we working hard enough 02:12:35.760 --> 02:12:36.620 to make sure that like, like this cost? 02:12:36.620 --> 02:12:37.520 Yeah. 02:12:37.520 --> 02:12:38.380 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 02:12:38.400 --> 02:12:40.860 And I think I've talked a lot on the show before 02:12:40.860 --> 02:12:45.160 about how a central aspect of my personal morals 02:12:45.160 --> 02:12:49.340 and ethics is human cost, right? 02:12:49.340 --> 02:12:53.800 So when you steal a pack of dental floss, you know, 02:12:53.800 --> 02:12:55.540 what is the human cost of that? 02:12:55.540 --> 02:12:57.660 You know, fairly negligible. 02:12:57.660 --> 02:13:00.800 Whereas when you steal an amount that's like equivalent 02:13:00.800 --> 02:13:03.200 to a year's work for someone, you know, 02:13:03.200 --> 02:13:06.020 I see that as like 1 50th of murder, 02:13:06.020 --> 02:13:07.280 if you get what I mean. 02:13:07.280 --> 02:13:08.120 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 02:13:08.400 --> 02:13:12.340 So you spent that time of their life doing something 02:13:12.340 --> 02:13:16.520 that was only to get their house or their car 02:13:16.520 --> 02:13:17.360 or whatever else it is. 02:13:17.360 --> 02:13:18.280 It might even be worse than that though. 02:13:18.280 --> 02:13:20.540 You're, you are, you're effectively, 02:13:20.540 --> 02:13:23.060 you're effectively stealing. 02:13:23.060 --> 02:13:23.900 What is that? 02:13:23.900 --> 02:13:25.820 You're effectively stealing life from them. 02:13:25.820 --> 02:13:29.380 And so I would reflect on this number and go like, 02:13:29.380 --> 02:13:31.580 am I stealing life or am I enriching it? 02:13:31.580 --> 02:13:32.820 You know, I got to- 02:13:32.820 --> 02:13:33.660 Yeah. 02:13:33.660 --> 02:13:34.500 Whew. 02:13:34.500 --> 02:13:35.400 Yeah. 02:13:35.400 --> 02:13:36.240 I don't know, just the kind of stuff 02:13:36.240 --> 02:13:39.090 that keeps me up at night, you know? 02:13:39.970 --> 02:13:40.810 Anywho. 02:13:42.390 --> 02:13:43.230 Moving on. 02:13:44.160 --> 02:13:45.660 I have another one for Michael. 02:13:45.660 --> 02:13:48.040 What's the best Christmas gift you guys have gotten 02:13:48.040 --> 02:13:52.220 from each other other than that was not work related? 02:13:52.220 --> 02:13:53.220 We don't give gifts to each other. 02:13:53.220 --> 02:13:55.280 The gift of not having to worry about it. 02:13:55.280 --> 02:13:56.560 Yeah. That's the best gift. 02:13:56.560 --> 02:13:57.620 It is a pretty good gift. 02:13:57.620 --> 02:13:59.440 Yeah. Hey Luke, guess what? 02:13:59.440 --> 02:14:00.740 Merry Christmas. I got you nothing. 02:14:00.740 --> 02:14:02.240 Merry Christmas, man. Me too. 02:14:02.240 --> 02:14:05.580 I, I was trying to think when I, so I curated that one. 02:14:05.580 --> 02:14:08.040 I was trying to think if there was something 02:14:08.040 --> 02:14:10.420 that we've ever like done. 02:14:10.540 --> 02:14:15.290 But I think it's just always been- 02:14:15.290 --> 02:14:16.570 Hey bro, I know you're busy. 02:14:16.570 --> 02:14:17.410 Yeah. 02:14:17.410 --> 02:14:18.230 Have a good one. 02:14:18.230 --> 02:14:19.730 Yep. Which is solid. 02:14:19.730 --> 02:14:20.570 Yeah. 02:14:20.570 --> 02:14:21.410 That's a good way to go. 02:14:21.410 --> 02:14:22.250 Yeah. It's good. 02:14:22.250 --> 02:14:26.390 Yeah. We are, are, nope, I'm not going to say that. 02:14:28.320 --> 02:14:29.320 I'll say this. 02:14:29.320 --> 02:14:33.440 There are more people where I feel some amount of obligation 02:14:33.440 --> 02:14:36.740 to give Christmas gifts to this year. 02:14:36.740 --> 02:14:38.020 And it's a lot of people. 02:14:38.020 --> 02:14:39.580 Yeah. It's a pain. 02:14:39.580 --> 02:14:40.420 And like I- 02:14:40.420 --> 02:14:41.260 I hate it. 02:14:41.260 --> 02:14:42.420 I don't, I don't mind it as much as, as you do. 02:14:42.420 --> 02:14:47.900 But at a certain point, I'm like trying to tally in my head. 02:14:48.580 --> 02:14:52.340 I'm like, have I completed my shopping 02:14:52.340 --> 02:14:53.640 for all these different people? 02:14:53.640 --> 02:14:57.060 And I'm like, this is a lot of people. 02:14:57.060 --> 02:14:58.600 And then trying to keep track of that. 02:14:58.600 --> 02:15:00.880 And you don't want to just like run to a mall 02:15:00.880 --> 02:15:03.140 and buy garbage the week before Christmas. 02:15:03.140 --> 02:15:05.020 So you try to think about it like throughout the year. 02:15:05.020 --> 02:15:06.800 And it's like, man, there's a lot of things to, 02:15:06.800 --> 02:15:08.950 to like keep track of. 02:15:08.950 --> 02:15:10.610 Yeah. But yeah. 02:15:10.610 --> 02:15:12.470 My family's been talking about trying to like, 02:15:12.470 --> 02:15:13.950 reduce and stuff. 02:15:13.950 --> 02:15:17.230 Cause we like something that we do is we try to reuse 02:15:17.230 --> 02:15:19.010 Christmas packing as much as possible. 02:15:19.010 --> 02:15:19.890 Yeah. 02:15:19.890 --> 02:15:23.230 So like brown paper bags are used very often. 02:15:23.230 --> 02:15:25.030 Last year's tags that you put on things. 02:15:25.030 --> 02:15:25.870 For sure. 02:15:25.870 --> 02:15:27.350 We just put them in a box and you just re-tape it on. 02:15:27.350 --> 02:15:28.190 Like, who cares? 02:15:28.190 --> 02:15:30.370 We try to do stuff like that to make it less of a waste. 02:15:30.370 --> 02:15:33.090 And we've all been communicating to each other 02:15:33.090 --> 02:15:35.350 for a while now to like, don't try, 02:15:35.350 --> 02:15:37.630 try to really avoid buying people things 02:15:37.630 --> 02:15:39.770 that are likely going to end up being garbage. 02:15:39.770 --> 02:15:40.610 Yeah. Right. 02:15:40.610 --> 02:15:42.450 But we're- 02:15:42.470 --> 02:15:44.270 we're probably going to continue down, 02:15:44.270 --> 02:15:46.130 continue down that path to a certain degree. 02:15:46.130 --> 02:15:46.970 Yeah. 02:15:46.970 --> 02:15:48.970 We use a newspaper in my family. 02:15:48.970 --> 02:15:50.090 Cool. Yeah. That's a good one. 02:15:50.090 --> 02:15:52.230 We've run out of newspaper. 02:15:52.230 --> 02:15:53.190 It's become a problem. 02:15:53.190 --> 02:15:54.610 The only thing newspaper is good for. 02:15:54.610 --> 02:15:56.430 So it makes sense that it's all getting used 02:15:56.430 --> 02:15:57.270 to wrap presents. 02:15:57.270 --> 02:15:58.090 Yep. 02:15:58.090 --> 02:16:00.190 We used to use the comics pages specifically. 02:16:00.190 --> 02:16:01.030 That's cool. 02:16:01.030 --> 02:16:01.870 That's actually nice. 02:16:01.870 --> 02:16:02.750 Yeah. That's actually pretty sweet. 02:16:02.750 --> 02:16:04.970 Yeah. I try and do the princess auto for dad. 02:16:04.970 --> 02:16:08.750 And then like, you know, anyway, this one's from Zachary. 02:16:08.750 --> 02:16:11.910 Will you publish an external 3D model of the screwdriver? 02:16:11.910 --> 02:16:13.910 Publishing the model is common in industry 02:16:13.910 --> 02:16:16.950 and it would facilitate 3D printed LTT driver case 02:16:16.950 --> 02:16:17.950 I'm designing. 02:16:17.950 --> 02:16:21.810 PS, why no PH00, Phillips double zero 02:16:21.810 --> 02:16:24.410 or PH triple zero bits in the Phillips set? 02:16:24.410 --> 02:16:26.570 All right. You got a couple of questions here. 02:16:26.570 --> 02:16:29.530 Yes, we have considered publishing an external 3D model 02:16:29.530 --> 02:16:30.810 of the screwdriver. 02:16:30.810 --> 02:16:33.550 We need to make sure that we have the proper authorization 02:16:33.550 --> 02:16:35.730 from the other parties involved in the design. 02:16:35.730 --> 02:16:37.890 So whatever we might feel about it, we, 02:16:37.890 --> 02:16:39.310 it was a collaborative product. 02:16:39.310 --> 02:16:41.670 So we need to make sure that everybody's on the same page. 02:16:41.910 --> 02:16:46.410 Yeah. We'd, we'd love to make your life easier 02:16:47.330 --> 02:16:49.750 for, for 3D printing the driver case you're designing. 02:16:49.750 --> 02:16:54.750 So stay, stay tuned as for why no precision bits it's 02:16:55.450 --> 02:16:58.030 because it's really not the intended use case of the product. 02:16:58.030 --> 02:17:00.530 And we don't wanna encourage people to over-torque those kinds 02:17:00.530 --> 02:17:03.290 of products with a, with a big old honking screwdriver. 02:17:03.290 --> 02:17:06.370 That's really more for like computer work, 02:17:06.370 --> 02:17:08.990 utility work around the house, automotive work. 02:17:10.340 --> 02:17:11.100 That's why. 02:17:11.100 --> 02:17:12.880 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 02:17:12.900 --> 02:17:17.140 tuned though our plan is to have a product where that type of a bit would be more appropriate 02:17:19.770 --> 02:17:25.370 okay this one's from aj how did luke become the ceo of Floatplane were you offered the job or did 02:17:25.370 --> 02:17:31.290 you apply ask for it i've heard you talk about coding development before did you do that before 02:17:31.290 --> 02:17:38.090 you started working at ltd i find it very thematic uh that this came from a person named aj as aj was 02:17:38.090 --> 02:17:44.730 the first person that we hired for the project and is still uh lucky instrument luckily to me 02:17:44.730 --> 02:17:50.570 instrumental and is still working on the project um i am not tonight i am yeah he's bailing us out 02:17:50.570 --> 02:17:55.610 potentially right now actually because as far as i know he can't download this second one until 02:17:55.610 --> 02:17:59.930 we're done oh we should finish this he's on east coast time we should so we actually should close 02:17:59.930 --> 02:18:07.290 this shout out aj thanks aj sorry thank you thank you this is not the first time and it will not be 02:18:07.290 --> 02:18:07.930 the last time 02:18:08.090 --> 02:18:16.490 that i call aj out of nowhere and i'm like hey uh i need you to save me uh he's in chat yeah hi 02:18:17.690 --> 02:18:19.050 sorry thank you 02:18:21.050 --> 02:18:28.010 um yeah uh i so i'm not the ceo of Floatplane um how is i how did i get the job well oh oh 02:18:28.010 --> 02:18:35.610 yes i'm ceo and probably cto too is that official or is that just no effective i mean yeah he runs 02:18:35.610 --> 02:18:37.770 it um let's put it that way yeah i 02:18:38.250 --> 02:18:43.050 so when vessel went down vessel was a platform that we used to be on that did early access 02:18:43.050 --> 02:18:48.090 video or whatever when vessel went down we started a thing on the forum which was just a sub part of 02:18:48.090 --> 02:18:54.570 the forum called rip vessel and i found a way to mess with the forum software that we had to force 02:18:54.570 --> 02:19:00.410 video to sort of maybe kind of go through it the idea was that people could download it and that 02:19:00.410 --> 02:19:06.170 sort of worked and then we realized by accident that a bunch of browsers do you remember this 02:19:06.170 --> 02:19:07.210 a bunch of browsers 02:19:08.090 --> 02:19:11.690 would determine that they could just stream the video yeah as a download 02:19:13.290 --> 02:19:18.250 s yeah it would just like play it and we were like wait what is it that easy that's pretty cool 02:19:18.250 --> 02:19:21.290 this should be really easy to do and then uh spoiler alert 02:19:22.570 --> 02:19:30.810 it's really hard um and then pretty early in i was like whoa i have no idea what i'm doing 02:19:30.810 --> 02:19:37.290 uh and aj actually posted a big like i think it was a google doc that he shared 02:19:38.090 --> 02:19:43.250 think that's how it was done, but he posted a big thing on the forum being like, uh, yeah, 02:19:43.250 --> 02:19:49.450 by the way, here's a plan for like, probably a better, more proper way of doing what you're 02:19:49.450 --> 02:19:57.910 trying to do. Um, and it was fairly similar to what Jake, Jake Tyvie and I had kind of 02:19:57.910 --> 02:20:02.090 come up with, but again, we weren't really prepared and AJ's proposal for it was like 02:20:02.090 --> 02:20:07.210 way better. So I was like, Hey, help me. Um, and then we've just been sort of doing it 02:20:07.210 --> 02:20:11.110 ever since there was never really, I don't think there was ever really like I didn't 02:20:11.110 --> 02:20:16.750 apply for it. I don't think I asked for it. Oh, definitely not. It just, yeah, it's, it 02:20:16.750 --> 02:20:22.210 just sort of happened. It was a revenue source that we had absolutely no replacement for 02:20:22.210 --> 02:20:27.910 that time. We really needed one that we needed and there was no other platform that was really 02:20:27.910 --> 02:20:32.570 doing what vessel was doing. So we needed to port people somewhere and we needed it 02:20:32.570 --> 02:20:35.890 now, which basically meant we needed to develop it internally. 02:20:35.890 --> 02:20:37.190 And I was the only person who 02:20:37.190 --> 02:20:41.350 had any chance and I barely had a chance and then AJ bailed me out. And then we brought 02:20:41.350 --> 02:20:46.650 on, uh, Yuki not way too long after that, both of those peeps are still on the team 02:20:46.650 --> 02:20:52.110 and still killing it. Um, and we would be nowhere without them. Um, and then we brought 02:20:52.110 --> 02:20:55.830 up other people along the way and now we're here. I don't know. It just, it just, it sort 02:20:55.830 --> 02:21:02.890 of happened. It was very not formal. I'll say that much next step. 02:21:02.890 --> 02:21:08.090 All right. This is for Luke. Hey, okay. You pretty clearly play have played D and D or 02:21:08.090 --> 02:21:08.950 other tabletop games. 02:21:08.950 --> 02:21:10.350 I mean, I don't know if you've ever played a tabletop role-playing games. Could you talk 02:21:10.350 --> 02:21:11.350 about that? 02:21:11.350 --> 02:21:15.790 Sure. I'll, I'll try to make it relatively short. Played a bit of D and D in high school, 02:21:15.790 --> 02:21:20.050 played a bit of D and D in university, played a bit of D and D after university. Never like 02:21:20.050 --> 02:21:23.430 super seriously, always very socially. Um, 02:21:23.430 --> 02:21:31.100 Oh, oh, oh, hot take spicy Luke coming out right at the end of the show. 02:21:31.100 --> 02:21:37.500 No, no, it's sad. Luke. Oh, um, I, I rekindled the fire for that with Tyler. 02:21:37.500 --> 02:21:39.960 Okay. Sorry. Yeah. Um, 02:21:40.100 --> 02:21:48.860 So it's a bit of a sore topic for me now because I miss Tyler. Um, but I eventually, um, while 02:21:48.860 --> 02:21:53.260 knowing Tyler and I actually got Tyler kind of into it and he ended up running a campaign 02:21:53.260 --> 02:21:56.680 of this, um, without me, cause I couldn't play on the night that he wanted to run it 02:21:56.680 --> 02:22:01.760 and stuff, but we used to talk about this stuff all the time. Um, but I ended up playing 02:22:01.760 --> 02:22:07.860 edge of the empire with, uh, my brother and a couple of my, uh, my other friends and edge 02:22:07.860 --> 02:22:09.060 of the empire was really fantastic. 02:22:09.060 --> 02:22:10.060 I like it. 02:22:10.060 --> 02:22:15.000 I like it a lot because of how the dice work, because unlike with D and D where you have 02:22:15.000 --> 02:22:22.610 like your chance and your damage, um, in edge of the empire, you have, if I remember correctly, 02:22:22.610 --> 02:22:29.270 it's it's like damage dice. And then, oh man, it's been a long time since I played. So I'm 02:22:29.270 --> 02:22:33.190 going to say this wrong, but it's, it's like opportunity basically. And your dice have 02:22:33.190 --> 02:22:37.710 to roll against each other. So you have, you have pluses and minuses for each type. So 02:22:37.710 --> 02:22:41.750 if you, if you, uh, say you were, uh, this is edge of the empire. 02:22:41.750 --> 02:22:45.750 So it's a lot of like scoundrels and whatnot. So say you had like you're a hand solo type 02:22:45.750 --> 02:22:49.710 character, you've got a pistol, you're trying to shoot something that's down a hallway. 02:22:49.710 --> 02:22:56.090 Um, and you're, you're not going to do any damage. Your damage dice come up with, uh, 02:22:56.090 --> 02:23:01.950 zero or less than zero, but your, your advantage or disadvantage or whatever it was, it was 02:23:01.950 --> 02:23:07.290 called, um, dice came up with a large advantage. So now you have to come up with something 02:23:07.290 --> 02:23:08.290 that might be advantageous. 02:23:08.290 --> 02:23:11.750 And you think about the star Wars universe and you're like, okay, well the shot missed, 02:23:11.750 --> 02:23:15.810 it didn't hit the target that I wanted to hit, but let's have it hit the control panel. 02:23:15.810 --> 02:23:19.920 That's next to the door. So now the door closes on the person that's trying to run away from 02:23:19.920 --> 02:23:26.020 me and you can do cool, like thematic storytelling things through your dice rolls. And I really 02:23:26.020 --> 02:23:29.320 thought that was very cool. That added an element that I always felt was missing from 02:23:29.320 --> 02:23:30.320 D and D. 02:23:30.320 --> 02:23:34.860 Um, and yeah, I used to, I used to nerd out about that, um, with Tyler and then he ended 02:23:34.860 --> 02:23:39.540 up running a campaign and I, I believe they liked it. I think, uh, Alex Clark played in 02:23:39.540 --> 02:23:40.920 that campaign. 02:23:40.920 --> 02:23:41.800 I think. I don't know. 02:23:41.800 --> 02:23:42.800 I don't fully remember. 02:23:42.800 --> 02:23:43.800 Oh, I'm not sure. 02:23:43.800 --> 02:23:49.020 Um, but yeah, it was a long time ago, but yeah. Yeah. I've always played those games 02:23:49.020 --> 02:23:53.120 socially. I, I care a lot less for the game than I do for the people that I'm usually 02:23:53.120 --> 02:23:56.840 playing it with. 02:23:56.840 --> 02:24:01.840 And last one today's from Matthew. Hi Linus and Luke. It's Matt from the call challenge 02:24:01.840 --> 02:24:05.660 video. What's the deal with the beef between you and D brand? Are you longtime friends 02:24:05.660 --> 02:24:07.500 or is it just something fun you do now? 02:24:07.500 --> 02:24:08.500 I hate those guys. 02:24:08.500 --> 02:24:10.370 Does my bleep button work? 02:24:10.370 --> 02:24:13.210 you D brand. 02:24:13.210 --> 02:24:15.090 Seems to work. 02:24:15.090 --> 02:24:16.530 Go yourself. D brand. 02:24:16.530 --> 02:24:20.590 I think my favorite ad spot I've ever done was for D brand. Do you remember this? We 02:24:20.590 --> 02:24:22.850 were at, I had no authorization to do this. 02:24:22.850 --> 02:24:25.290 I don't watch ad spots for D brand because those guys. 02:24:25.290 --> 02:24:33.330 Fair enough. Uh, we were at CES back in the day and it was like only sponsored by D brand 02:24:33.330 --> 02:24:36.890 or something. So every video had a D brand sponsorship on it. And I was trying to make 02:24:36.890 --> 02:24:41.130 each one of them different. And I just ran out of ideas and eventually just said D brand 02:24:41.130 --> 02:24:44.090 like 30 times and gave no other information or context. 02:24:44.090 --> 02:24:52.990 And they loved it. So I was like, sweet. Yeah. I think if that was a lot of other brands, 02:24:52.990 --> 02:24:57.430 they probably wouldn't have been too impressed, but, uh, I had a, I had a hunch they'd roll 02:24:57.430 --> 02:25:03.000 with it and they did, which was cool, but yeah, screw those guys. 02:25:03.000 --> 02:25:11.620 Um, if D brand gets their way, I will be telling you guys about the car soon enough. Um, they, 02:25:11.620 --> 02:25:14.140 they, uh, 02:25:14.140 --> 02:25:15.140 oh, 02:25:16.640 --> 02:25:26.050 why can't i resist their money yes this okay okay okay this is why i love those guys 02:25:28.530 --> 02:25:40.110 oh my god oh my god they want me to put the most ass possible skin what is it can you say what it 02:25:40.110 --> 02:25:46.190 is it's like just like your own face a bunch of times no no no it's an actual product that 02:25:46.190 --> 02:25:55.870 is the kind of thing that might be fine in small doses but over an enormous enormous 02:25:57.470 --> 02:26:04.750 vehicle might be a little much oh my goodness that actually might look super cool 02:26:05.310 --> 02:26:09.230 but it might look super cool to see on a car one time and not look super cool 02:26:09.950 --> 02:26:16.980 to be on your car permanently yeah so i'm uh 02:26:18.100 --> 02:26:24.180 uh yes oh my goodness they're so annoying because they'll be like they'll be like hey 02:26:25.580 --> 02:26:28.060 no it'd be funny you want to drink a bunch of energy drinks 02:26:29.660 --> 02:26:36.940 hey want to do something totally stupid and i'm like no not really and they're like i'll pay more 02:26:41.740 --> 02:26:47.660 oh so good so good so we'll see how it goes it makes in their defense it 02:26:47.660 --> 02:26:47.740 makes it makes it makes it makes it makes it makes it makes it makes it makes it makes it makes it 02:26:47.740 --> 02:26:50.860 makes stuff work because it's going to stand out it's going to be interesting it's going to be 02:26:50.860 --> 02:26:54.460 punchy people are going to be interested in it but it's all stuff you're not going to want to do 02:26:55.180 --> 02:27:01.250 uh so yeah you got to pay more but i mean yeah gets it done all right see you later guys 02:27:04.050 --> 02:27:29.920 bye the show is brought to you by see sonic zoho one and vessi footwear 02:27:30.720 --> 02:27:36.080 oh i never said see you again next week same bad time same bad channel i didn't say it 02:27:36.080 --> 02:27:38.080 yeah